Utopia Talk / Politics / I Call BS On Swine Flu

Real Fred Member	Tue May 05 20:22:27 If it's such a fucking pandemic, then WHY the fuck is there only like 1,500 cases out of 6,000,000,000 people and it has spread across 20 countries? Seems to me there would be tens of thousands of people with it in a close proximity area. But there isn't. A few here, a couple there, that's pretty much it. It's fucking bullshit.
yankeessuck123 Member	Tue May 05 20:23:18 Hi, I was saying this a week or two ago.
HOer Member	Tue May 05 20:23:37 Too late, the dems already called BS on it. What the epidemiologists are seeing now with this particular strain of U.N. is that the severity of the disease, the severity of the flu -- how sick you get -- is not stronger than regular seasonal flu," Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano said Monday
Real Fred Member	Tue May 05 20:27:06 The MSM and US government should be put on trial for inciting worldwide panic and terrorism.
Camaban Moderator	Tue May 05 20:29:23 I thought it was just an imminent pandemic and never got past that stage (or rather, it skipped the pandemic stage)
HOer Member	Tue May 05 20:47:43 Texas officials report second U.S. swine flu death cnn
MrPresident07 Member	Tue May 05 20:48:29 Better safe than sorry I guess. If the government didn't say anything and this turned out to be something big, they'd be blamed for hating the citizenry and held responsible for every death that occurs.
MrPresident07 Member	Tue May 05 20:49:12 As much as I've grown to hate government these days, you cannot blame them for this. Unless of course, you could prove they deliberately hyped it up with the knowledge that it wasn't a big deal.
Milton Bradley Member	Tue May 05 21:04:51 This is a societal problem. They sensationalize anything. Fearmongering always works to get attention. Create something that might kill you and people will tune it to find out how to not die. Its a great plan for the media.
yankeessuck123 Member	Tue May 05 21:43:07 I don't think government is to blame, at least not primarily. The media desperately wanted a pandemic, and they tried to sell it as one. It was as hyped up and ultimately lacking as...bird flu :P
MrPresident07 Member	Tue May 05 21:46:39 Lol, yeah. MSM is destroying America.
yankeessuck123 Member	Tue May 05 21:55:07 But really, what is the solution? A for-profit news organization is always going to be motivated to pull shit like this, because it makes them money. And the alternatives? The government could provide news, but you can imagine how fair and balanced that would be. There are smaller news organizations that care more about pushing an agenda or getting out their message (prisonplanet for example), but again that isn't going to be fair and balanced. What else is there?
pillz Member	Tue May 05 21:57:48 Apparently swine flu lowers the immune system allowing other infections to kill the victim. Big deal.
PhunkyPhishStyle Member	Tue May 05 22:06:47 "Too late, the dems already called BS on it." - Too late for Fred maybe, but there was one guy I know of who called bullshit when dems were busy building the hype (like our VP warning his family not to travel): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TB5-Y08qbjo
Eikeys Ghost Sports Mod	Tue May 05 22:09:23 You should see the local NBC affiliate out of Detroit. You would think it's year two of the Black Plague or something. Some kids get the sniffles and 14 schools close.... If this isn't terrorism (Using terror and fear to alter life) I don't what the fuck is anymore... Oh wait. It's taking pictures of buildings. Seriously people... pitchforks and torches. Take our country back.
Galaga Member	Tue May 05 22:09:24 Actually Fred, we're at about 6.7 billion. If you're going to round, round to 7b.
Galaga Member	Tue May 05 22:09:30 :D
StabYourThroat Member	Wed May 06 00:56:06 It's better for them to alert us to a possible threat than to wait until it is too late to do anything and then cause even more panic.
PhunkyPhishStyle Member	Wed May 06 01:39:25 ^ typical lib response. I suppose it was better for them to 'be safe than rather than sorry' and go ahead and make vaccinations mandatory in the 70's too huh?
StabYourThroat Member	Wed May 06 01:40:32 ^^^ Horrible hack Alerting us to a threat and forcing us to take certain actions are two very different things.
PhunkyPhishStyle Member	Wed May 06 01:50:42 "I don't think government is to blame, at least not primarily. The media desperately wanted a pandemic, and they tried to sell it as one. It was as hyped up and ultimately lacking as...bird flu :P " - But media doesn't arrange nationally televised presidential speeches, arrange for consistent televised news briefing with the Dept. Of Homeland Security, nor declare national health emergencies...
Paramount Member	Wed May 06 03:47:08 " Seems to me there would be tens of thousands of people with it in a close proximity area. But there isn't. A few here, a couple there, that's pretty much it." Yup. Even the "normal" flu infects and kills more people.
HOer Member	Wed May 06 05:30:32 Its up to the friggin americans to not shit their pants at every thing the media prinits for christs sake. Everyone wants a free media, just learn not to shit a fuckin' brick at everything they say.
Nimatzo Member	Wed May 06 07:23:24 Jebus christ you people are dumb. The fact that Swine flu and the "seasonal flu" are both flus are beyond the fucking point and irrelevant. The DANGER in a pandemic flu is the fact that natural resistance in the population is very very low or non existent while with a seasonal flu a large portion of the population have a natural resistance to it, limiting spread and mortality. The danger in these pandemic flus are the fact that they kill YOUNG, healthy people with otherwise strong immune system. A seasonal flu kills the weak in the population, very young and very old.
Nimatzo Member	Wed May 06 07:29:11 This is so typical of the American version of stupidity. If it is too much of an obstacle for "my way of life" the clearly it can't be THAT dangerous. I hope this influenza blows up and weeds out all you morons.
Nimatzo Member	Wed May 06 07:41:57 A regular flu has roughly the mortality rate of 0.1% in comparison the Spanish flu has a mortality rate of 2.5-5%. So far the mortality rate of the Swine Flu has been around 0.1%. For people to go out about 1 month after the disease was detected and say that there is nothing to worry about is not only stupid, but outright dangerous. It took the Spanish flu about 4 months to start raking up dead bodies that would not go unnoticed.
PhunkyPhishStyle Member	Wed May 06 11:10:25 Nimatzo's government gives him a shot in his butthole with a meat syringe whenever the flu season starts up. What a lucky guy.
nhill Member	Wed May 06 11:13:41 lol
Nimatzo Member	Wed May 06 11:34:39 Oh lol look at the little cunt acting like a cunt. I assure you that what ever media frenzy and FOX ACTION NEWS you receive in your shithole country does not reach my country. In this country we look at everything pragmatically, with reason and without stupidity. Dangerous and communistic nanny state ideas, but seriously try them sometimes, maybe then you can write down semi-intelligent arguments.
PhunkyPhishStyle Member	Wed May 06 15:21:50 "...but seriously try them sometimes, maybe then you can write down semi-intelligent arguments." ...so you do think I should try Swedish anal flu injection?
Nimatzo Member	Wed May 06 18:42:43 I have always found your lame attempts to score brownie points with your neocon countrymen quite amusing. So that at least some portion of the forum will take you semi-seriously. Trust me all it does is make you look dazed and confused. You are just fueling the fire of the stereotype pothead. You could at the very least try to emulate some one other than Sam Adams, we already have one of him and he fulfills a role on this board, you are just pathetic.
Seb Member	Wed May 06 19:27:02 Real Fred: If you are interested, I have a friend who works on the science side of this. It does seem it's been over-rated, but they had to go nuts now, because if they had waited further and it had been dangerous, it would be unstoppable. In fact, if it had been dangerous, this was already reacting a bit late anyway. However, we are only part way through in that the typical patterns for flu strain is a little break out now, followed by a big bout in the winter. In the mean time, it could mutate. It is true the epidemiologists are shitting themselves about the next pandemic: the last big one was bad enough, but with population densities higher and mass global transport, the next one will be horrific. Call BS if you want, but it's a tad cheap. It's preferable to have a false alarm than for them to be correct in informing everyone there is a serious pandemic after it is too late to do anything. Kind of like an earth shattering meteor: you want NASA to warn you when you have time to do something, not wait until it's too late to do anything about it, but for them to be able to tell you precisely where it will land.
PhunkyPhishStyle Member	Thu May 07 00:28:42 "Call BS if you want, but it's a tad cheap. It's preferable to have a false alarm than for them to be correct in informing everyone there is a serious pandemic after it is too late to do anything. " ...it's preferable unless you were one of the hundreds of folks who were paralyzed or one of the 30some who died from forced vaccinations during the 70's, of course. So determining this 'preference' all comes down to how that 'false alarm' plays out. Do I think the government should shut up and ignore it? No. Do I think it's necessary that the CDC, Homeland Security, and even our President appear on national television to essentially encourage Americans to be more hygienic and avoid travel to flu hot spots? Probably not. Is this type of action adding massive amounts of fuel to the already blazing media hype? Absolutely.
PhunkyPhishStyle Member	Thu May 07 00:29:12 Also, sorry for getting your panties in a bunch, nim.
StabYourThroat Member	Thu May 07 00:57:56 I am become BACON, the destroyer of worlds. P.S. Hamthrax is coming for you
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 04:15:38 I am sorry that you are so stupid PPS, really I am.
Cthulhu Member	Thu May 07 04:21:29 ^^^ Obvious Liar
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 04:23:37 This type of thing breaks people down in 3 categories. Nr 1: WE ARE ALL GOING TO DIE!! Quick buy ammo, canned food and head for the hills. Nr 2: This is nothing, it's a hoax! ... Nr 3: This could be bad, let's follow this more closely and see what happens. Only one is an intelligent approach.
nhill Member	Thu May 07 04:29:20 Nr 4: Doesn't look to be bad, no need to waste more resources on it at this juncture. If it develops into something more serious, then we can re-evaluate.
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 05:14:10 >>Doesn't look to be bad<< Tell me how the fuck would you know after 1 month? What are you credentials in the field of human biology, epidemiology and medicine? None? Ok with or without credentials what is the reasoning behind the conclusion that this "Does not look bad"? That it hasn't destroyed mankind in 1 month? You belong to category nr 2. There are no "ifs" and "re-evaluate" with pandemics once they have gone past a certain point. You either get them very early or you do not. With these things you are better safe than sorry. People seem to be under the illusion that there are many other things in the world that are a great threat to our species than pandemics. Nuclear war, asteroids and Pandemics. These three things have the potential to destroy us. We should avoid them at all cost.
nhill Member	Thu May 07 05:15:10 "Tell me how the fuck would you know after 1 month?" Because it doesn't look to be to bad. I thought that was made clear in the first post.
nhill Member	Thu May 07 05:15:57 And I wasn't categorizing myself. Does everything have to be ad-hominem with you?
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 05:19:23 I need to rephrase the question. How would you know what bad is for a pandemic that will become a disaster after only 1 month? Note that I am not saying this will be a disaster. I am asking how you would know what it would look like after 1 month.
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 05:21:10 >>Does everything have to be ad-hominem with you?<< This is not a valid question, this is UP.
nhill Member	Thu May 07 05:22:42 So far there have only been 2 deaths in the entire world outside of Mexico. Given its 2-7 day incubation period, things appear to be fine for now (outside of Mexico, of course). Re-evaluation may be needed if it gets worse, as per my original post.
nhill Member	Thu May 07 05:25:25 "So far there have only been 2 deaths in the entire world outside of Mexico." To clarify, 2 deaths that I've heard of. There could very well been 2 billion deaths that I'm not aware of, have you heard any different?
Cthulhu Member	Thu May 07 05:25:29 One thing everyone seems to ignore too is that influenza has a propensity to mutate. The fact the death toll is very small now means nothing. it could mutate to become harmless, it might not mutate at all. These two categories aren't dangerous. If it mutates into something deadly, we could all be wiped out. There is currently no way to tell what will happen until it happens, so all they can do is prepare as much as possible. There are viruses out there that are more than capable of decimating the planet if they spread to the right place. Example, asshole catch ebola Zaire on vacation, he gets on a return flight to new york while contagious before showing any major symptoms. The entire plane catches it. Some of those people are only stopping for layovers before heading elsewhere. Before the world knows it, the most deadly and contagious virus in the world has now spread halfway across the world. How long do you suppose it takes before we are fucked? When it comes to new strains of the flu, there are very little to no innate resistances to it. So what happens if we decide to just ignore it until it does mutate to become deadly lethal? How many people already have it by the time we realize its gone postal? How do we know in advance that it can't sit in the soil indefinitly, or on railings in public places? All you have to do then is not wash your hands before touching your mouth or eyes after you have touched a hand railing and you now have the virus. We also now have seen virus that can feed off medicine. Sure, maybe the odds are against it, but in the last century, 10's of millions of people have died to pandemics. Now we have high population densities all over the world, and the technology to travel to the other side of the world in less than 24 hours. This can very quickly become an issue of the survival of the human race, and I for one would rather they cause a bit of panic than wait until bodies are racking up by the millions. So say what you want about overblowing things, humans are not pre-cognitive. So if you think that they should be able to tell in 1 month whether we are dead 2 years from now from a deadly virus, you need your head examined.
nhill Member	Thu May 07 05:30:07 ^Nr 1
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 05:40:48 You are arguments are just ignorant. The growth of these things are exponential and very hard to stop once they reach a critical point. This has already been explained in this thread once before. You do not have time to re-evaluate. Reaction time and early effort is everything with a pandemic. These are not opinions it is how diseases work. These things usually come in TWO waves. The first one will have a mortality rate similar to an ordinary flu, the second wave will be epic. Read up on the Spanich flu and you will understand exactly why the expert in the field are scared. Because there are too many things that are similar. The Spanish flu was widespread during a summer period, when most flus are rampant during winter. What month are we in now and what season are we going in to? Right. Spanish flu was killing off a lot young people when flus ordinary kill very young and very old and people with immunodeficiencies. Same here. Just think a little, there is a reason the medical community does not panic every winter when there is a flu going around. Maybe just maybe there years of research, education and experience counts for more than opinions?
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 05:43:17 >>ebola<< There is actually a vaccine for Ebola.
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 05:46:24 nhill Member Thu May 07 05:30:07 ^Nr 1 What part of what he said was untrue?
Camaban Moderator	Thu May 07 05:49:49 Oh yeah, that was the one where a woman pricked herself by accident and had to take it fairly sharpish wasn't it? http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,511096,00.html
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 05:55:12 Sorry my memory was a bit fuzzy it seems the vaccine I was thinking of was working on monkeys xD Though we can be very far off if they even managed to scrape one together like this.
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 05:56:12 Spoke too soon again, it apparently works on humans as well but you need to take it very early.
Cthulhu Member	Thu May 07 06:00:37 and the problem with a virus like Ebola is just how quickly it multiplies. Extreme magnification is not funny.
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 06:05:15 Yes and being an RNA virus is can mutate very rapidly.
PhunkyPhishStyle Member	Thu May 07 10:11:28 "Read up on the Spanich flu and you will understand exactly why the expert in the field are scared..." Likewise, read up on the Swine Flu scare of 1976 (similar for obvious reasons), and you will understand why some people are skeptical. Hundreds of Americans were killed or seriously injured by the inoculations the government forced upon them to stave off the virus. In contrast, just 1 19yr old soldier - the one who spurred the scare - died from the flu. "Tell me how the fuck would you know after 1 month? What are you credentials in the field of human biology, epidemiology and medicine?" Yet in 1976, not even a month after the first (and only) death, F. David Matthews, secretary of health, education, and welfare released the statement: "There is evidence there will be a major flu epidemic this coming fall. The indication is that we will see a return of the 1918 flu virus that is the most virulent form of the flu. In 1918 a half million Americans died. The projections are that this virus will kill one million Americans in 1976." Interesting. There's your credentials after not even a month of time. Our government today isn't even saying these things remotely this serious, yet you criticize those who are skeptical that this will turn into anything significant? Let me ask you - if the government, tomorrow, released a similar statement, would you support mandatory inoculations?
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 10:52:47 >>Swine Flu scare of 1976<< They mutate and the one in 1976 is not the same as the one now. It is understandable that they did get scared since the virus was closely related to the Spanish flu virus. The 1976 one did not even manage to get past American borders, this one has spread around the world in less than 1 month. You think there is a difference in the grade of natural resistance between the two? >>Interesting. There's your credentials after not even a month of time.<< I'm just curious, the vaccination DID go through and 33% of the American population were inoculated. How would you exactly go about and tell us that it did not have an effect? Let's assume they were indeed wrong. Would you rather they had been right and done nothing? >>Our government today isn't even saying these things remotely this serious<< You seem confused, are they blowing this out of proportion or are they handling it well? >>yet you criticize those who are skeptical that this will turn into anything significant?<< Because the critics are idiots and fail to grasp that a pandemic that goes nowhere and one that ends up killing half the human population both start the same way, rather slow and seemingly harmless. The difference in how many it will kill rests on how fast you react, what you do and how well you do it, something the "critics" also fail to grasp. This is not about my opinion against your opinion, this there is no argument. It is the medical facts versus your ignorance. >>Let me ask you - if the government, tomorrow, released a similar statement, would you support mandatory inoculations?<< If by government you mean scientist and experts in the field, then yes. The CDC is operated by scientists I believe medicine is still one of the few fields where actual MERIT is valued higher than political affiliation and track record.
Real Fred Member	Thu May 07 11:24:21 The whole deal is a fucking scare tactic/jew job to sucker money out of regular people. Over the counter bullshit drugs and tamiflu etc are all huge profits for big pharma. Hell, we were ALL supposed to die of fucking AIDS back in the 80's, and yet AIDS is a fucking joke for the most part. A few jiggaboos in africa die from it but not many besides that.
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 11:33:42 ^^Grade A idiot talking out of his ass, disregarding the fact of sex education campaigns, AIDS awareness campaigns. AIDS would have been a much bigger issue without those things.
Real Fred Member	Thu May 07 11:37:52 The hype over AIDS back then was idiotic. Fucking scare shit on TV/radio/print day in and day out for months on end. Scared the piss out of everyone. When the simple solution was "don't fuck". Campaigns my ass, another huge bullshit waste of time and money.
Nimatzo Member	Thu May 07 11:44:45 http://www.avert.org/usa-statistics.htm Yep didn't work at all.
roland Member	Thu May 07 11:47:10 Fred probably prefer to have AIDS than someone scare the shxt out of him.
Real Fred Member	Thu May 07 11:48:58 I didn't say it didn't work. I said it was a bullshit waste. All you had to do was say stop fucking and sucking and sharing needles and you won't get AIDS. That's all those retarded campaigns did anyway but to a much greater extent because most people are stupid fucking idiots, like yourself.
PhunkyPhishStyle Member	Thu May 07 11:50:25 'They mutate and the one in 1976 is not the same as the one now.' - Nor is this one the same as the Spanish Flu. 'It is understandable that they did get scared since the virus was closely related to the Spanish flu virus. The 1976 one did not even manage to get past American borders, this one has spread around the world in less than 1 month. You think there is a difference in the grade of natural resistance between the two?' Not sure what you mean by this. Of course there are differences between the two - but we aren't pointing those out, we are pointing toward similarities. This flu might be traveling so fast because of our current state of global travel - not to mention a global population has since increased by the billions and almost 2/3 of that growth has been in urban environments. Plenty of factors to consider. 'I'm just curious, the vaccination DID go through and 33% of the American population were inoculated. How would you exactly go about and tell us that it did not have an effect? Let's assume they were indeed wrong. Would you rather they had been right and done nothing?' You're missing the point. You criticized people for not having credentials and trying to call this too early(after just one month), and then I presented evidence of someone with credentials that called another swine flu even earlier. I'm assuming then, that if you were in the States back in 1976 you would have been critical of them jumping the gun after just weeks, no? 'You seem confused, are they blowing this out of proportion or are they handling it well?' So far they are handling it decently - though I know nothing of the actual workings/research going on. The problem is that the media is exacerbating the issue for a story, and the government is playing into that hype. It's simply not necessary to have the POTUS appear on national television to tell Americans to wash their hands. Simple, updated, and well thought-out statements from the CDC delivered to media would suffice. 'Because the critics are idiots and fail to grasp that a pandemic that goes nowhere and one that ends up killing half the human population both start the same way, rather slow and seemingly harmless.' - I don't get it. It seems you place yourself in a hybrid category consisting of the 1st and 3rd you listed? It seems you want to keep watching this thing closely, but want to run for the hills with ammo and canned goods(not literally) in a 'better safe than sorry' attitude. 'The difference in how many it will kill rests on how fast you react, what you do and how well you do it, something the "critics" also fail to grasp.' - I've said this very thing in my post about 'preferences'. There's a fine line between watching something closely and preparing for worst-case-scenarios and actually implementing measures after weeks of research. 'This is not about my opinion against your opinion, this there is no argument. It is the medical facts versus your ignorance.' - Fuck off. You're acting like a kid on a playground. 'If by government you mean scientist and experts in the field, then yes. The CDC is operated by scientists I believe medicine is still one of the few fields where actual MERIT is valued higher than political affiliation and track record.' - So it's too early for people to say this isn't going to be anything serious but not too early for them to say it's going to kill millions?
Real Fred Member	Thu May 07 11:50:40 It's kinda like smoking. It says right on the pack that it can kill you, yet people still smoke.
HOer Member	Thu May 07 12:34:00 'The problem is that the media is exacerbating the issue for a story, and the government is playing into that hype. It's simply not necessary to have the POTUS appear on national television to tell Americans to wash their hands. ' Why such paranoia in the US about so much stuff? In Europe, the media makes a huge fuss, we realize the media is making a huge fuss, if the govt makes a statement on TV about it, we don't start panicking and filling our cellars with weapons and cans, we note that its probably good to wash our hands, and to keep an interested eye on whats going on until it subsides and carry on with our lives. Theres noone freaking out or panicking about this over here. Americans need to chill and not be so frightened all the time.
nhill Member	Thu May 07 13:24:33 "You're acting like a kid on a playground." Umm.. This is Nimatzo we are talking about here, he is a kid and he always acts like he's on the playground. The funny thing is he actually believes his wanton sophistry. He's a child with megalomaniac tendencies and should be in a mental hospital.
Seb Member	Thu May 07 13:25:32 PPS: "...it's preferable unless you were one of the hundreds of folks who were paralyzed or one of the 30some who died from forced vaccinations during the 70's, of course." They now take that into account when considering vaccination programmes. You will note at this point, nobody has geared up mass vaccination programmes. This lesson has been learned, and is not in the range of policy options being pushed at the moment, so raising it is a bit of a red herring. Real Fred: It's a waste until they don't react to a pandemic. In which case the opportunity cost of not reacting will likely be somewhat greater than all the "scare mongering" put together. So, in that sense, it isn't a waste at all. As for it being a scare to get everyones money, it isn't really. Taht would be to assume the rest of the world uses the US economic model for health care, which they don't.
Nimatzo Member	Fri May 08 05:59:50 >>- Nor is this one the same as the Spanish Flu.<< It shows similarities with is and so did the 1976 one. What is it that you do not understand? If something shows similarities with something that killed as many people as WW2 you are stupid if you do not get at the very least worried. You might even overact. That does not mean that the next time something similar pops up that you can just dismiss it as another "scare". Hopefully you have learned a few things since last time and you can judge it better and not "overreact". >>I'm assuming then, that if you were in the States back in 1976 you would have been critical of them jumping the gun after just weeks, no?<< Most likely not, I, we the world might have learned a few more things since 1976 which allows us to better judge these things today. You are looking at 1976 with the knowledge you have today and saying they did wrong. Arguable, but say that based on hindsight they did do wrong. Would "we" have done it differently if we were in their shoes, most likely not. Are we doing it differently today? Clearly. >>I don't get it. It seems you place yourself in a hybrid category consisting of the 1st and 3rd you listed? It seems you want to keep watching this thing closely, but want to run for the hills with ammo and canned goods(not literally) in a 'better safe than sorry' attitude.<< I would watch these things closely and know the limitations of my own knowledge in the field. I know enough about biology, chemistry, virology, pathology etc. etc. to not get confused or bamboozled, but I know next to nothing compared to the people who are working with it. At some point I need to put my trust in other people and I will with no remorse put my trust in science. If they say "the shit has hit the fan" I will take their word for it. If it turns out it was just a little tiny shit or no shit at all I will not get angry or dismiss whatever next they say. Have you lived in a warzone PPS? I have, I was 5-6 years old when Iraq started to bomb Iranian cities with scuds and airplanes. My grandfather house was next to a military base. When the sirens went off and TV interrupted programs to warn of an impending air raid, we got the fuck out of the houses, into the street or into basements. Most of the time YOUR house was not destroyed, but the cost/benefit was in favor of getting to safety. There was no panic, no scare, you just knew it was the most beneficial thing to do in your own interest. There is a great amount of stupidity in that some how a "scare" and overreaction every quarter of a century is more of an inconvenience than a full fledged pandemic every now and then. Like I said there is a reason they do not react the same way to every flu or virus. Just like in Iran if Tehran was targeted sirens did not go off in Shiraz. >>- Fuck off. You're acting like a kid on a playground.<< That is fucking rich, your first 2 responses to me in this thread where pure insults in the spirit of your cock buddy Sam Adams. I have at least the decency to incorporate my insult into my arguments. You came into this thread insulting me and now you have a problem with it? Go kill yourself you fucking cunt, I have no more time for idiots like you.
Nimatzo Member	Fri May 08 06:09:15 >>Real Fred Member Thu May 07 11:48:58 I didn't say it didn't work. I said it was a bullshit waste. All you had to do was say stop fucking and sucking and sharing needles and you won't get AIDS.<< This is part of what they did you fucking moron! They informed people on how to avoid it, how you could get sick, how you could protect yourself. And yea abstinence has worked sooooo well historically that this was and it worked so well with AIDS. Thank goodness people a lot smarter than you were heading these AIDS awareness programs. Instead of telling people stop fucking they said wear this when you fuck.
Nimatzo Member	Fri May 08 06:12:01 >>All you had to do was say stop fucking and sucking and sharing needles and you won't get AIDS.<< Of course none of this costs any time or money. In the world of Fred ad time, work force and material are all free. Fucking idiot.
Real Fred Member	Fri May 08 06:58:16 "Instead of telling people stop fucking they said wear this when you fuck. " Wearing a rubber does not guarantee AIDS prevention, only abstinence does that. For someone who claims to know so fucking much about the subject, you really are one dumb fuck.
Nimatzo Member	Fri May 08 07:03:21 >>Wearing a rubber does not guarantee AIDS prevention<< And yet the protection if gives is 1000 times better than "abstinence" which has failed so miserably. I don't know if you are just trolling or really this fucking dumb. You are actually saying that telling people to not fuck gives a better protection against AIDS than telling them to fuck with a condom. Even if there is a 10% risk to be exposed to the virus when using a condom the fail rate of trying NOT to fuck is so much higher that it is not even a contest. GG idiot.
Real Fred Member	Fri May 08 07:07:39 " I don't know if you are just trolling or really this fucking dumb. " My job here is finished. GG.
Nimatzo Member	Fri May 08 07:11:31 I am glad I gave you a way to gracefully step out of the shithole you dug for yourself. I don't for a second believe you were trolling.
Real Fred Member	Fri May 08 07:14:13 LOL
Bushwasdabespresid Member	Fri May 08 11:16:50 'condums r more effective than abstanance' rofl
Real Fred Member	Fri May 08 15:54:43 " Even if there is a 10% risk to be exposed to the virus when using a condom the fail rate of trying NOT to fuck is so much higher that it is not even a contest."--nimnutzo How can you FAIL at NOT fucking? What do you walk by some hot chick and accidentally fuck her? "Oh, sorry ma'am, I didn't mean to fuck you just now, I was seriously trying to NOT fuck you but I failed". Jesus H. Fucking Christ, your stupidity level is record setting.
Madc0w Member	Fri May 08 16:08:50 The irony of you calling him stupid when you can't even comprehend what he just said...
Real Fred Member	Fri May 08 16:13:40 "fail rate of trying NOT to fuck" I'm pretty sure I understand that. Please explain to me where I might be wrong.
Nimatzo Member	Fri May 08 16:59:23 You are even a bigger retard than I thought. Let me tell you how fail at NOT fucking aka abstinence. YOU FUCK!!! OMFG!! It's amazing isn't it? Freaking MAGIC!
Seb Member	Fri May 08 17:04:32 Real Fred: People fuck anyway. From the point of view of public health: "We need to stop the spread of this disease, if we tell everyone not to fuck, 90% of people will continue to fuck. If we tell people to use a condom, 90% of people will use a condom. Sure, the condom will not always be effective, but the fail rate of a condom combined with the uptake of people following our advice will be better than relying on telling people not to fuck". And in any case, a certain amount of fucking is necessary if we are to maintain the tax base in the face of rampant opposition to immigration.
Nimatzo Member	Fri May 08 17:08:18 What is really pathetic is that he back out of this thread under the guise thathe was trolling, while in reality he was in the basement trying to think up a way to make a "come back".
Real Fred Member	Fri May 08 17:12:04 The reality is you are too fucking stupid to tell trolling from reality and that I drove over 400 miles between posts.
Nimatzo Member	Fri May 08 17:38:07 That says more about your attempts of being serious than about my understanding of "reality". You should be thankful I gave you the benefit of the doubt when reading the retarded shit you write and assume that it could be troll bait.
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