Utopia Talk / Politics / Ukraine is now BLIND!

LazyCommunist Member	Wed Mar 05 09:13:43 It's over, Russia has won, thanks to our new ally USA! http://www...0185b7415579?sharetype=blocked US cuts off intelligence sharing with Ukraine Fresh blow to embattled government in Kyiv as Trump administration shifts on conflict The US has cut off intelligence sharing with Kyiv in a move that could seriously hamper the Ukrainian military’s ability to target Russian forces. The step follows the decision on Monday by the Trump administration to suspend military aid deliveries to Ukraine and comes after a dramatic breakdown in relations between the US president and Ukraine’s Volodymyr Zelenskyy. US intelligence co-operation has been essential for Ukraine’s ability to identify and strike Russian military targets. Four officials familiar with the decision confirmed that Washington had frozen intelligence channels with Kyiv. John Ratcliffe, director of the CIA, later told Fox Business: “Trump had a real question about whether President Zelenskyy was committed to the peace process, and he said let’s pause.” But he added that there was hope of the support being restored. “I want to give a chance to think about that, and you saw the response that President Zelenskyy put out,” Ratcliffe added. “So I think on the military front and the intelligence front, the pause that allowed that to happen, I think will go away.” While the US has also formally blocked its allies from sharing US intelligence with Ukraine, two officials said that recipients with assets inside the country were likely to continue passing on relevant intelligence to Kyiv. But that would not apply to time-sensitive and high-value intelligence, such as that needed for Ukraine to conduct precision strikes on moveable Russian targets. “If they don’t reverse it soon, it will become really difficult for the Ukrainians because it takes away their battlefield advantage,” said a senior western official. The US decision to ban its allies from passing intelligence to Ukraine was first reported by the Daily Mail. After a heated Oval Office clash between Zelenskyy and Trump, relations between Washington and Kyiv deteriorated before recent signs of repair. Zelenskyy made a show of contrition on Tuesday, saying the meeting in front of the television cameras was “regrettable” and Ukraine was “ready to come to the negotiating table as soon as possible”. He also said in a letter he was ready to sign a deal with Trump “at any time” that would give the US the rights to profit from exploiting Ukraine’s natural resources. In his address to Congress on Tuesday night, Trump — who has previously called the democratically elected Zelenskyy a “dictator” — said he appreciated the Ukrainian leader’s words. On Wednesday Mike Waltz, US national security adviser, also suggested military aid to Ukraine could be restarted. “I think if we can nail down these negotiations and move towards these negotiations, and in fact, put some confidence-building measures on the table, then the president will take a hard look at lifting this pause,” Waltz told Fox News. A spokesperson for Ukraine’s military intelligence refused to comment on how a cut-off of US intelligence would affect its work. “We have a plan B,” the spokesperson said earlier this week. The extent of the US’s intelligence support is classified but analysts said it allowed Kyiv to receive live intelligence on the enemy’s movements. At an “operational level, to look at the movement of forces for example, satellites are a big help and US capabilities are really important”, said Mykhailo Samus, a Ukrainian military expert. US intelligence also plays a role in the early warning system against Russian missiles and drone raids on Ukrainian cities and energy infrastructure. “Ukraine’s military intelligence has never said exactly what type of info they get from the US,” said Pavlo Narozhny, a Ukrainian military analyst. “But you can make an educated guess, you can note the Reaper drones and American planes flying regularly near the border, you can see that every time a Russian MiG-31 takes off, it triggers an air raid alarm across Ukraine.” Where US intelligence may have been the most crucial has been in allowing precision strikes on Russian-held territory. “Static targets like factories or oil plants” were “something we can do ourselves”, Narozhny said. “But we’ve been able to hit command centres, kill generals, and this was probably done with the help of US intelligence.”
murder Member	Wed Mar 05 09:25:02 Ukraine should target Trump and Musk.
TheChildren Member	Wed Mar 05 09:30:36 it was over years ago... xcept 4 in da fakemedia
Seb Member	Wed Mar 05 10:38:16 Murder: Oh I think the Ukrainian GRU are going to make Mossad look kind and fluffy in years to come.
Seb Member	Wed Mar 05 10:43:02 The US is dumb though. Ukraine isn't going to agree to unreasonable terms, they'll just keep fighting with a hand tied behind their backs; and Russia hasn't got enough power to win or force the kind of concessions it wants. If Trump's plan is to end the war quickly so he can get the Russian economy going and focus on China; he's going the wrong way about it. It's Russia that needs to be forced to the table. I think this just results on driving a bigger wedge between Europe and the US. There's going to be a point where if someone flew a plane into a building in the US, instead of invoking A5 Europe would cheer it on instead Not that far away I feel.
TheChildren Member	Wed Mar 05 10:46:22 O.o? http://www...s_britain_from_sharing_any_us/
Dukhat Member	Wed Mar 05 12:35:28 Trump manufactured a controversy with Ukraine and now is cutting them off which is what he was going to do in the first place. His pal Putin caused the inflation which cooked the Dems in this election and got Trump re-elected. It's so fucking obvious and sad.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 01:58:21 They US is clearly now seeking to collaborate with Russia to force Ukraine into surrender and partition. Macron's speech does not go far enough in recognising the US is now an enemy of the free world. The massive increases in defense spending are welcome, but they need to be focused foremost on supporting Ukraine then on an expanded nuclear warfare capability and on replacing US capabilities.
Rugian Member	Thu Mar 06 02:06:03 Seb You are existing in a state of delusion. http://x.com/TheRabbitHole84/status/1896610013604675813
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 03:47:09 Rugian: You are living in a state of corruption. "Someone else should pay" is not an unexpected result. The role of political leadership is to fill that gap. There's broad consensus in Europe: Ukraine should not be thrown under a bus, and Americans are treacherous backstabbing bastards, allied to Russia, who cannot be trusted.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 03:50:50 When the Times and multiple former heads of the British armed forces and deputy SACEURs are publicly warning that the UK must separate from the US and build fully independent nuclear weapons, ISTAR etc. that tells you what you need to know. The US standing in Europe is toast.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 03:57:59 Rugian is the kind of pusillanimous fuck that would consult polls and advise Churchill not to offer "Blood, toil, tears and sweat" but instead cut a deal with Germany to divide Europe. You aren't even a nation of Chamberlains, you are a nation of Halifaxes. And that's only what the very best of you rise to.
murder Member	Thu Mar 06 07:19:37 "The massive increases in defense spending are welcome, but they need to be focused foremost on supporting Ukraine then on an expanded nuclear warfare capability and on replacing US capabilities." It's too late Seb. The only way to avoid the defeat of Ukraine at this point would be for European countries to involve themselves in the war directly. It would have to be decisive action to resolve the war quickly because Europe cannot afford an extended proxy war. -
Rugian Member	Thu Mar 06 07:44:24 Seb I think I finally understand why you've been melting down over JD Vance's Munich speech for the past several weeks. The point of that speech was essentially that European governments need to remain true to their values and respect the democratic will of their citizens. For an anti-democratic power structure like the EU, that *IS* a direct attack on the fundamental values of their bureaucrats. Oh Seb. What a self-report you just committed.
murder Member	Thu Mar 06 07:56:18 Says someone who supports a guy who tried to overthrow the government to stay in power.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 09:15:55 Murder: You are far too bearish. Rugian: It absolutely was not, as we can see by your government's subsequent actions: attempting to impose a colonial regime on Ukraine and Canada though a mix of economic and military coercion. It was exactly what it purported to be: a declaration of a new cold war between American Aurocrats and the free countries that embrace cooperation, the rule of law, and rights based individual liberties.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 09:16:58 Basically rugian, you are in denial.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 09:31:58 Murder: Basically, Russia isn't in a position to break through, and their economy is suffering. I would love direct intervention but the risk has gone up there hugely: the US can and must be assumed to turn off a number of things mid-air or provide intel to Russia. The sky shield proposal has legs though and we should do it. Meanwhile, drones and artillery to keep bleeding Russia.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 09:33:07 We need to get starlink out and replaced with IRIS. Eutelsat stock is up 500%. Doubt anyone wants to use Starlink now they know the US will cut it off to extort you in the middle of a war.
murder Member	Thu Mar 06 09:37:14 The fact that Russia is still fighting is a good indicator that their economy isn't suffering as much as we've been led to believe. Also, it's going to start improving as soon as Trump starts lifting sanctions and probably starts signing deals with Russia. Hell Trump may start stockpiling rubles right along with the other shitcoins in his new "strategic reserve". -
Forwyn Member	Thu Mar 06 09:43:48 "free countries that embrace cooperation, the rule of law, and rights based individual liberties." Just not the right of secession following a violent coup
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 09:50:29 Murder: "The fact that Russia is still fighting is a good indicator that their economy" Why do you think they are so desperate for a ceasefire? Immediately after Trump/Zelensky implosion, Fico & Orban - Putin's proxies in Europe - were straight on pushing the EU negotiate directly with Putin. Russia has burned through it's stocks, it can't keep up with the current rate of losses, but if it stops attacking the Ukrainians will start to push back. They are facing fuel shortages and manpower shortages across the economy. They desperately need a pause to regroup/reset and then they'll be much stronger; but they can't continue the current conflict. Trump deals with Russia aren't that significant. Geography etc. EU sanctions will remain in place which will complicate things. I agree Europe should start making moves for direct intervention though. But it's now the end of the world right now that it does not.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 09:51:00 Forwyn: Get that russian cock out of your mouth.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 10:02:13 Apparently the US pulled HIMARS data link just as the UAF we're achieving success in counter offensives. A literal stab in the back by the US to protect their Russian allies.
Rugian Member	Thu Mar 06 10:09:25 Seb 1) Zero military pressure has been exercised against either Ukraine or Canada 2) The minerals deal with Ukraine was an implicit security guarantees, and the best Ukraine was likely to get given that NATO-style guarantees were never on the table. There was consideration for both parties in that agreement 3) Putting tariffs on another country is not an act of colonialism. If your standard for colonialism is the denial of free access of markets, then the majority of countries on the planet are in some sort of colonial relationship. Not to mention that Canada enjoys the protections of NATO membership despite the fact that they are in flagrant violation of NATO membership requirements. If Canada doesn't want to be militarily dependent on the US, they are welcome to triple their defense spending at any time. 4) You really, really misinterpreted the point of that speech if you walked away from it thinking that it was an implicit declaration of war.
murder Member	Thu Mar 06 10:22:10 "The minerals deal with Ukraine was an implicit security guarantee ..." No it wasn't. It was a vulture feeding on a carcass. It was Trump trying to rape Ukraine because that is his impulse whenever he sees someone vulnerable. WTF kind of "security guarantee" implicit or explicit could the US provide when we're leaving Europe? I know you're in the cult, but you can't be that dense. -
Rugian Member	Thu Mar 06 10:28:09 We're not leaving Europe. That's a total fantasy in your head. If you can't comprehend how having Americans working in certain areas of Ukraine provides some insulation against foreign attack, then you my friend belong in remedial school.
murder Member	Thu Mar 06 10:58:42 There were Americans in Ukraine when Russia invaded. There were Americans in Israel when Hamas attacked. There were Americans in the United States when al-Qaeda attacked. It doesn't mean shit. -
Forwyn Member	Thu Mar 06 11:19:04 "Doubt anyone wants to use Starlink now they know the US will cut it off to extort you in the middle of a war." Maybe if you actually pay for it, you can have a claim to unrestricted access. "Get that russian cock out of your mouth." I know, it's difficult for a Brit to accept that people sometimes want to break away from their states. Better to kill them, the English way.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 06 11:48:53 Seb Russia controls the pace of combat operations. It is losing things and humans exactly as fast as it wants to. So by definition sustainable. Ukraine on the other hand, does not control the pace of losing things and humans. Nor does it control the pace of replacements. We are still in "inflict costs" mode, not "win" mode.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 06 11:49:36 Forwyn Poland is picking up the starlink bill for Ukraine.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 12:45:14 Rugian: You turned off air defense and targeting, and leaked it to the press knowing the Russians would exploit it. That's military pressure. "Putting tariffs on another country is not an act of colonialism." The demands that have been made are. "You really, really misinterpreted the point of that speech if you walked away from it thinking that it was an implicit declaration of war" Most of Europe took it that way. This seems it is very much a "you" problem. The mainstream understanding is that the US is engaging in a unprecedented back stab to Europe and Ukraine. I think you are just desperately trying to rationalise Trump/Vance, but I don't really care what you think. Everyone else that matters has made up their minds at this point and they aren't going to be persuaded they got it wrong by words, or by actions at this point. My only recommendation for you is to decide on some criteria, some red line, that if crossed would convince you that Trump and Vance are malevolent threats to US interest, and watch out to see it isn't crossed.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 12:49:58 Rugian: "We're not leaving Europe" Of course you are. Your SECDEF is already ordering draw downs, Trump is preparing to announce he'll only defend countries spending 5% on defence (the US doesn't spend that), and we've just seen you turn off key defense capabilities including air raid early warning, of an ally you made security declarations to (Budapest). Nobody trusts the US now. Nobody will trust the US now. Nobody believes the US will honour it's treaties, because it's repeatedly broken them. That's why many European countries are asking for a French nuclear umbrella right now. It's why European defence and space firms are hugely up, and American defence firms are down. The Atlantic alliance is stone dead, and if you are surprised at that you must be completely autistic.
Seb Member	Thu Mar 06 12:52:00 Jergul that's a daft definition of sustainable. They are losing huge numbers now because they are betting on a cease fire on their terms if they do. They cannot afford, at this point, not to keep going at this pace or the momentum shifts to Ukraine.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 06 21:38:50 Seb Sigh, do you never learn?
jergul large member	Thu Mar 06 21:41:13 It does not really matter. The war has to continue until absolutely everyone realizes that the best day for Ukraine to negotiate was yesterday.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 06 21:43:05 The power of revanchism gave us word war 2. That is why the thought that Ukraine could have won if only it had not been betrayed has to be laid to rest.
Seb Member	Fri Mar 07 04:06:47 http://bsk...bsky.social/post/3ljrir3ctek2u Jergul: I suggest it is you that never learn. The revanchist threat is Russia - as you have long pointed out the belief of Russian elites that the collapse of the USSR was a global catastrophe that must be reversed. In your framing, the end of the cold war was WWI/Versailles - and we are now in WW2. The important thing here is to recognise that Russias ambitions are well beyond a slice of Ukraine; and there will be further conflict unless Russian revanchism is thoroughly defeated.
Seb Member	Fri Mar 07 04:11:55 Unless your idea is to retreat back to the boundaries of pre 1991 NATO & let Russia dictate to the counties in the EU; What's your answer? As the thread I posted raised - the obvious question is: "If Biden couldn't deter Russia from attacking Ukraine, why will it be deterred from attacking Ukraine or the Baltics or Poland if Trump is disengaging run Europe and courting Russia?" Russian hybrid war has been going on Europe since 2014, with great efforts to turn a blind eye. Wake up! Ukraine is not an unfortunate root cause, it's a symptom of Russia's imperial ambitions towards Europe as expressed by its leaders for ages. Even Yeltsin used to pester Bush and Clinton about when the US was now going to leave Europe and let Russia run it in a global partnership with the US.
murder Member	Fri Mar 07 07:52:24 "That is why the thought that Ukraine could have won if only it had not been betrayed has to be laid to rest." That's literally what happened.
TheChildren Member	Fri Mar 07 08:43:38 intarestin...so not just blind but literally turned USELESS over night... http://www...ne-access-us-missile-and-drone also confirms that this is not ukraine vs russia but russia vs usa by ukraine proxy. every action we have seen in da last 3 years gloatin about deep in2 russia, was basically murica not ukraine. wuld xplain why it is murica and russia negotiatin and vassals r not allowed 2 join yet
LazyCommunist Member	Fri Mar 07 13:06:22 Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhahahahahaha! We can now do whatever we want, he will do nothing in response. Buy Ruble now, in just a few months our currency will rise again. You will make more profit than with bitcoin. Life is good! http://x.com/wartranslated/status/1898064003290562602 During a press conference, the U.S. president was asked if he believes Putin wants to end the war after Russia's massive strike on Ukraine. He replied, "I believe, I believe. They're relentlessly bombing Ukraine, but it's harder for me to deal with Ukraine than with Russia — they don't have cards."
Paramount Member	Mon Mar 10 15:55:42 http://youtu.be/__DTh5st1Mg Thousands of fleeing Ukrainian invaders are being killed by artillery, drones, and by Russian attack helicopters. Ukrainian elite soldiers are surrendering en masse. Oh my… they probably regret invading Kursk now. Was it the Brits idea?
Rugian Member	Mon Mar 10 15:57:20 Has Alexander Mercouris ever had a positive assessment of the Ukrainian war effort? I mean, there's providing objective analysis that falls outside of the mainstream consensus...but this guy ain't doing that.
Paramount Member	Mon Mar 10 16:11:13 There’s nothing positive about the Ukrainian proxy war effort to talk about.
TheChildren Member	Tue Mar 11 11:42:39 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DlRZOnNLqEg u know shits bad when propfunda channels r openin admittin shits bad... shit must be near collapse
TheChildren Member	Tue Mar 11 11:44:29 thsi shit reminds of me aliens where da humanoid droid crawls through da tunnels and shits http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNi58q3HCAQ
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