Utopia Talk - Politics - The Most Important SC Court Case EVER

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Utopia Talk / Politics / The Most Important SC Court Case EVER

Dukhat
Member Tue Dec 05 23:42:25
https://www.politico.com/story/2017/12/05/gay-wedding-cake-supreme-court-280944

Supreme Court appears split in fight over cake for gay wedding

Colorado bakeshop owner claims anti-discrimination law intrudes on his free expression rights.

"A Christian baker who refused to make a wedding cake for a same-sex couple found unexpected traction for his position at the Supreme Court Tuesday, as the justices wrestled with a high-profile clash between religious beliefs and anti-discrimination laws.

"The high court's champion of gay rights, Justice Anthony Kennedy, seemed troubled by Colorado officials' treatment of Masterpiece Cakeshop owner Jack Phillips after he turned down Charlie Craig and David Mullins' request for a custom cake to celebrate their wedding in 2012."

First our cakes. What's next? Our guns? Our children?

I know this, if gay wedding cakes existed at the founding of our country, the civil war would've happened 80 years earlier.

patom
Member Wed Dec 06 06:11:00
Jack Phillips seems to be of the opinion that the mere act of making a wedding cake makes him part of the actual ceremony.

I just turned 74 and been to a bunch of weddings and never once saw the cake maker take part in the ceremony. Now I suppose there could be a Justice of the Peace or a Judge or a few others that perform weddings that might make cakes as a sideline but the mere act of making a cake doesn't have diddly to do with the ceremony.

Personally if I were gay or anything else and I met this kind of response from someone who might make something I would ingest. I would walk away. I would however sue the shit out of them for embarrassing me because they didn't have clearly stated advertisement that they hated me and my kind on their establishment. It would be a cold day in hell before I would give them money to perform any act or make any product.

Hot Rod
Revved Up Wed Dec 06 06:41:25

Phillips is an artist.

He tells a story of the couple with the cake. That's where the free speech comes in.

How would you liberals feel if you were forced to write a conservative speech for President Trump?

hood
Member Wed Dec 06 07:32:27
"He tells a story of the couple with the cake. That's where the free speech comes in."

Oh fuck you. That's absolute crap. He makes cakes. This has nothing to do with free speech. Freedom of association, sure. But not free speech.

patom
Member Wed Dec 06 09:45:04
The design of the cake never came into question. As soon as he found out who the cake was for he refused them.

patom
Member Wed Dec 06 11:32:29
http://www...olorado-gay-wedding-cake-case/

pillz
Member Wed Dec 06 11:50:40
He shouldn't have to cater to a gay wedding.

Forwyn
Member Wed Dec 06 13:25:59
Would be a non-issue if the baker were a Muzzie.

murder
Member Wed Dec 06 13:39:28

There is zero reason why anyone should be compelled to bake a cake for a gay wedding. It's hardly an essential service. I don't give a shit about "religious liberty", but liberty and freedom of association is a whole other kettle of fish.

CrownRoyal
Member Wed Dec 06 14:13:10
" It's hardly an essential service."

well, thats why plaintiffs picked this scenario, it is such an edge case. Even the cake is question is a custom made cake, I think if the baker refuses to sell one of his regular floor products, there is no case in front of SC

murder
Member Wed Dec 06 15:08:32

There shouldn't be a case. Take your business elsewhere.

CrownRoyal
Member Wed Dec 06 15:20:35
then why mention essential services? Take your business elsewhere, if you are denied essential services. Who even gives a crap what people consider essential. I might have adifferent opinion, based on my faith

McKobb
Member Wed Dec 06 16:41:14
Should an atheist cake maker be forced to make religious cakes? Should a black cake maker be forced to make confederate cakes? Should a Jewish cake maker be forced to make a Nazi cake? Should a dod cake maker be forced to make cat cakes? Find a cake maker that wants to make your cake!

CrownRoyal
Member Wed Dec 06 17:03:29
don't know what colorado public accommodations law says about cats and dogs cakes, but it is clear on businesses being unable to refuse service based on gay/straight distinction, that much I gathered from wiki and today's flood of articles

murder
Member Wed Dec 06 21:58:23

"then why mention essential services?"

Because essential services are essential, and wedding cakes are not.

murder
Member Wed Dec 06 22:05:04

"don't know what colorado public accommodations law says about cats and dogs cakes, but it is clear on businesses being unable to refuse service based on gay/straight distinction, that much I gathered from wiki and today's flood of articles"

There's no sound reason for that except politics. That should be unconstitutional.

show deleted posts

Dukhat Member	Tue Dec 05 23:42:25 https://www.politico.com/story/2017/12/05/gay-wedding-cake-supreme-court-280944 Supreme Court appears split in fight over cake for gay wedding Colorado bakeshop owner claims anti-discrimination law intrudes on his free expression rights. "A Christian baker who refused to make a wedding cake for a same-sex couple found unexpected traction for his position at the Supreme Court Tuesday, as the justices wrestled with a high-profile clash between religious beliefs and anti-discrimination laws. "The high court's champion of gay rights, Justice Anthony Kennedy, seemed troubled by Colorado officials' treatment of Masterpiece Cakeshop owner Jack Phillips after he turned down Charlie Craig and David Mullins' request for a custom cake to celebrate their wedding in 2012." First our cakes. What's next? Our guns? Our children? I know this, if gay wedding cakes existed at the founding of our country, the civil war would've happened 80 years earlier.
patom Member	Wed Dec 06 06:11:00 Jack Phillips seems to be of the opinion that the mere act of making a wedding cake makes him part of the actual ceremony. I just turned 74 and been to a bunch of weddings and never once saw the cake maker take part in the ceremony. Now I suppose there could be a Justice of the Peace or a Judge or a few others that perform weddings that might make cakes as a sideline but the mere act of making a cake doesn't have diddly to do with the ceremony. Personally if I were gay or anything else and I met this kind of response from someone who might make something I would ingest. I would walk away. I would however sue the shit out of them for embarrassing me because they didn't have clearly stated advertisement that they hated me and my kind on their establishment. It would be a cold day in hell before I would give them money to perform any act or make any product.
Hot Rod Revved Up	Wed Dec 06 06:41:25 Phillips is an artist. He tells a story of the couple with the cake. That's where the free speech comes in. How would you liberals feel if you were forced to write a conservative speech for President Trump?
hood Member	Wed Dec 06 07:32:27 "He tells a story of the couple with the cake. That's where the free speech comes in." Oh fuck you. That's absolute crap. He makes cakes. This has nothing to do with free speech. Freedom of association, sure. But not free speech.
patom Member	Wed Dec 06 09:45:04 The design of the cake never came into question. As soon as he found out who the cake was for he refused them.
patom Member	Wed Dec 06 11:32:29 http://www...olorado-gay-wedding-cake-case/
pillz Member	Wed Dec 06 11:50:40 He shouldn't have to cater to a gay wedding.
Forwyn Member	Wed Dec 06 13:25:59 Would be a non-issue if the baker were a Muzzie.
murder Member	Wed Dec 06 13:39:28 There is zero reason why anyone should be compelled to bake a cake for a gay wedding. It's hardly an essential service. I don't give a shit about "religious liberty", but liberty and freedom of association is a whole other kettle of fish.
CrownRoyal Member	Wed Dec 06 14:13:10 " It's hardly an essential service." well, thats why plaintiffs picked this scenario, it is such an edge case. Even the cake is question is a custom made cake, I think if the baker refuses to sell one of his regular floor products, there is no case in front of SC
murder Member	Wed Dec 06 15:08:32 There shouldn't be a case. Take your business elsewhere.
CrownRoyal Member	Wed Dec 06 15:20:35 then why mention essential services? Take your business elsewhere, if you are denied essential services. Who even gives a crap what people consider essential. I might have adifferent opinion, based on my faith
McKobb Member	Wed Dec 06 16:41:14 Should an atheist cake maker be forced to make religious cakes? Should a black cake maker be forced to make confederate cakes? Should a Jewish cake maker be forced to make a Nazi cake? Should a dod cake maker be forced to make cat cakes? Find a cake maker that wants to make your cake!
CrownRoyal Member	Wed Dec 06 17:03:29 don't know what colorado public accommodations law says about cats and dogs cakes, but it is clear on businesses being unable to refuse service based on gay/straight distinction, that much I gathered from wiki and today's flood of articles
murder Member	Wed Dec 06 21:58:23 "then why mention essential services?" Because essential services are essential, and wedding cakes are not.
murder Member	Wed Dec 06 22:05:04 "don't know what colorado public accommodations law says about cats and dogs cakes, but it is clear on businesses being unable to refuse service based on gay/straight distinction, that much I gathered from wiki and today's flood of articles" There's no sound reason for that except politics. That should be unconstitutional.
	show deleted posts

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