Utopia Talk / Politics / United Does it Again

Dukhat Member	Wed Mar 14 16:08:14 http://www...out/ar-BBKc8Wa?ocid=spartanntp A grieving family is speaking out after, they say, a United Airlinesflight attendant forced them to put their dog in an overhead bin, where he died in flight. The 10-month-old French bulldog was kept there for the entire three-and-a-half hour trip from Houston to New York Monday. The airline has apologized. ********************************************** Yeah, fuck United. What the fuck.
Sam Adams Member	Wed Mar 14 16:18:19 Fake? Was it dead already?
Paramount Member	Wed Mar 14 16:28:32 Maybe the flight attendant took orders from Russia?
Hot Rod Revved Up	Wed Mar 14 17:26:03 She said she did not know there was a dog in the carrier. The family had made it clear when they bought their tickets that they were transporting a live doggie and they met all of the requirements including buying a ticket for the doggie. Not sure what killed the poor little pup. Is there air in those upper bins or did it die of fright? Bouncing around in the pitch black must have been scary for the little guy. Just heard on TV the family said the flight attendant was lying when she said she didn't know there was a doggie in the carrier.
Forwyn Member	Wed Mar 14 21:23:00 Retired airline captain Denny Kelly says the pitch black overhead bin is dangerous for any live animal. "There is no circulation at all in there," Kelly said. "They're scared, their heart rate goes up and they use more oxygen. And there's not enough oxygen in the first place, that just makes it worse."
obaminated Member	Wed Mar 14 23:37:42 I don't really feel particular outrage at United for this. It seems like this individual screwed up, whether on purpose (unlikely) or by total accident (likely). It is a sad and unfortunate story though.
hood Member	Thu Mar 15 00:35:14 United failed. Whether they hired a shitty person or completely failed at training their staff appropriately, they are responsible for this outcome.
obaminated Member	Thu Mar 15 01:27:48 so, for the thousands of pets that make through a flight alive and fine (albeit probably suffering from ptsd because pets shouldnt be put on planes...) this one death is a big deal? That's stupid reactionary thinking that avoids context and facts.
Dukhat Member	Thu Mar 15 01:50:24 Obaminated proving again he's a helpless selfish retard that makes up facts to reinforce his world view. Fucking eat shit and die dumb fuck.
hood Member	Thu Mar 15 07:31:06 "this one death is a big deal?" If it was a person who died to complete fucking negligence, would you be saying "oh it's no big deal, it was just one bad stewardess!" hmm? Yeah, being this incompetent is a big deal. We're talking airplanes. When people make mistakes, hundreds of lives are at stake. We should demand as much perfection as possible, including stewardesses not recklessly endangering animals. "That's stupid reactionary thinking that avoids context and facts." Context: Family brought a 10 month old puppy with them on a plane. They bought an extra seat for the carrying cage. United is responsible for the actions of their employees and for properly training those employees. Facts: The dog was forced to ride in an overhead bin. The dog died. United is responsible. Just like they were responsible when they bloodied up a passenger and dragged him off the flight because they overbooked and needed to remove someone. Doesn't matter if it was an overzealous or improperly trained employee. United is responsible.
Rugian Member	Thu Mar 15 07:53:30 "If it was a person who died to complete fucking negligence, would you be saying "oh it's no big deal, it was just one bad stewardess!" hmm?" Human beings are not dogs. No one is saying that United isn't responsible here, they're saying it's not a big enough deal to be outraged over if you aren't personally affected by the error. Which is the correct position to hold.
hood Member	Thu Mar 15 07:56:03 "Human beings are not dogs." Insert comment about the girl who backstabbed you here. You gonna stick with that stance? ;p I'd say it's a big enough deal that I wouldn't bother flying United anymore. They've demonstrated that nothing is safe on their planes.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 08:17:08 A procedural problem. Bags containing pets should be clearly marked (electronically and physically), and the bag dimensions checked to see if they match safety requirements (fit under seat). A stewardess arguing with passengers about putting things in the overhead bin should not assume that the stewardess is listening to every nuance of the passengers argument. Proper storage is a critical part of cabin safety and is job number 1.
hood Member	Thu Mar 15 08:19:17 ^ didn't bother reading, or would know that the family literally bought an extra seat for the pet. Proper storage wasn't the problem.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 08:19:52 The core issue is the pet bag being too big to stow under the seat in front of the passenger. Who is to blame for that?
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 08:20:29 hood It does not matter if they bought a seat for the pet, it still has to be securely stored.
hood Member	Thu Mar 15 08:23:25 They bought an extra seat. Why do you think it is airline policy to buy an extra seat for transporting animals? Extra leg room? Or, I don't know, maybe to actually put the animal in the extra seat!? There was a perfectly good empty seat for the dog to be stored in, as per airline policy. Airline fucked up.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 08:26:26 Where does it say they bought an extra seat? Not that it matters. baggage has to be stored in the overhead bin, under the seat in front, or checked into the hold.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 08:33:21 http://www...t/travel/animals/in_cabin.aspx "The kennel must fit completely under the seat in front of the customer and remain there at all times"
hood Member	Thu Mar 15 08:52:31 "Where does it say they bought an extra seat?" Can't actually find it anymore. Perhaps they edited the story. Anyway, interesting tidbit I found while looking for the "bought extra seat" comment: "According to a US Department of Transportation report issued in February, 24 animals died in the care of US carriers last year. Three-quarters of those, 18, died while being handled by United. Of 15 reported injuries, 13 occurred with United." But according to mt, it's just a one time incident and we shouldn't hold United accountable.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 09:17:51 http://www.../304356/unitedredacted2017.pdf The moral of that story is don't fly with pets. They fucking hate it.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 09:22:15 I am going to go out on a limb and suggest United may be overrepresented because its registering and reporting systems for pet injury and deaths are very good. Description of Incident: 2 Geckos were discovered deceased upon arrival at RDU. Cause of Incident: Cause of death is undetermined. No medi cal exam was performed. Corrective Action Taken: No corrective action required.
Dukhat Member	Thu Mar 15 10:01:06 "The kennel must fit completely under the seat in front of the customer and remain there at all times" Cool story bro. They did however forget the part how they make the pet die because of a few cm of clearance. "I am going to go out on a limb and suggest United may be overrepresented because its registering and reporting systems for pet injury and deaths are very good. " Part of the reason Nazis get a bad rap. They were very good at documentation. Meanwhile Stalin kills many more people and history forget its because Soviet record-keeping was bad. Same as the Mongols who destroyed entire civilizations in their meaningless conquests.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 10:30:59 Dukhat Wow.
obaminated Member	Thu Mar 15 10:46:46 "But according to mt, it's just a one time incident and we shouldn't hold United accountable." No, as per usual MT is all about the context. Okay, so we have 18 dead over how many thousands that flew on United and survived? Also, the family's story has already changed, (they bought and seat and okay maybe we didn't buy a seat). I am sorry for being a stickler for individual responsibility but maybe, just maybe, you shouldn't put a 10 month old puppy on a plane where it can develop PTSD and shit itself whenever it hears loud noises for the rest of it's life ? Also, Cuckhat has jumped the shark again by bringing up Nazis and Stalin.
Dukhat Member	Thu Mar 15 10:53:18 Jergul - I forgot the /s for irony. Obaminated always with these complicated explanations to justify his own lack of empathy. Which makes it more bizarre when he adopts the narrative-of-the week from fox news when he pretended to care about mental health issues and had no idea how he sounded. The very height of narcissism. Just admit you don't care instead of blabbering about shit you don't know anything about.
hood Member	Thu Mar 15 10:59:12 "I am sorry for being a stickler for individual responsibility" And yet you're shirking the responsibility of the stewardess and her employer. They accept animals on planes. They accept the responsibility to safely transport those animals. "where it can develop PTSD" Speaking of jumping the shark...
obaminated Member	Thu Mar 15 11:08:51 Eh, animals shouldn't be on planes, they never come out the same. That isn't jumping the shark. Also, you ignored the primary point I made which is about context because 18 dead over the presumably thousands that flew is a blip on the radar and not worth outrage nor does United deserve this social media backlash it is getting. This is what happens when reactionary retards get a platform to congregate on.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 11:11:31 They don't even accept the responsibility of providing animals with air in the case of an emergency. The problem is as I said in my initial post. Procedural. United needs to electronically and physically mark bag containing live pets, and additionally assure that bags containing pets physically fit under seats (for example by no longer allowing soft carry-on kennels). For cargo pets - better kennels need to be designed. Specifically for sound reduction and of a material the lessens the likelihood of the pet hurting itself. For owners: What the fuck? Don't take pets on aircraft. They hate it.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 11:12:21 Obam 2.5 per 10 000 animals to be exact (2017).
hood Member	Thu Mar 15 11:17:36 "Also, you ignored the primary point I made which is about context because 18 dead over the presumably thousands that flew is a blip on the radar" Because that tired argument is always thrown out whenever someone wants to minimize the importance of something tragic. "OH NO, SOMEONE GOT SHOT!!! Welp, no big deal. Statistically insignificant." You know I work in healthcare. You have any idea how easy it would be for us to just casually wash our hands (har) of the statistically insignificant number of times a critical accident causes either severe pain or death? Yet somehow we hold ourselves responsible. United holds themselves responsible. And they should. Imagine the number of (human) casualties we could start seeing if statistically insignificant issues just slipped by without accountability in aviation. And it's certainly a relevant tidbit that despite the general rarity of pets suffering injury or death on a plane, that United is responsible for an overwhelming majority of them.
Sam Adams Member	Thu Mar 15 13:32:05 You fly 200 million dudes around safetly, kill one dog and beat up one dude, somehow you get a bad name?
Paramount Member	Thu Mar 15 13:34:13 I would rather fly with someone who won’t beat me up and kill my dog.
Sam Adams Member	Thu Mar 15 13:39:04 What about someone with a 1 in 200 million chance of beating you up and a 1 in 10,000 chance of killing your dog?
Dukhat Member	Thu Mar 15 13:47:09 Getting beat up or having your dog killed is not cancer. It's not to due to random luck. You cuckservatives are using the same retard arguments from the gun debate. It's like your brains don't work and you only sound somewhat cogent when some Koch-brothers talking point is fresh in your mind.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 13:49:39 Dukhat I specifically posted the incident reports for 2017. What procedural or policy changes do you recommend United make?
TJ Member	Thu Mar 15 13:58:03 It’s a consequence of our hyper-social nature. :)
Dukhat Member	Thu Mar 15 13:59:16 Not hiring fucking retards. Procedures shouldn't take precedence over real lives.
jergul large member	Thu Mar 15 14:10:52 I find the employee explanation credible. Procedure under no circumstances allow for stowing dogs in the overhead lugage bin.
Hot Rod Revved Up	Fri Mar 16 04:06:11 They were talking about this on FOX earlier. The stats for, not sure of the duration, dead pets is United 18 All other domestic airlines 2.
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