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Utopia Talk / Politics / Saudi Barbaria
Sun Oct 07 04:07:44
Saudi journalist 'killed inside consulate'

Jamal Khashoggi, a critic of Riyadh, had gone to the building in Istanbul seeking documents for his marriage

Turkish officials believe that missing Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi was killed inside the Saudi consulate in Istanbul and his body later driven from the compound.

Authorities say they believe Khashoggi’s death was premeditated and that Saudi officials had travelled to Istanbul from Riyadh after receiving word that the high-profile critic of the current Saudi leadership planned to visit the consulate.

In an evening of quickfire developments, following four days of silence since his disappearance, officials in Ankara pledged to on Sunday release evidence that they say supports claims that the journalist was killed shortly after he entered the consulate to sign divorce papers. The evidence is expected to include video footage and focus on a black car.

Two Turkish officials claimed to Reuters that Khashoggi, 59, had been killed. The Reuters claim was circulated by a government spokesman, and confirmed by numerous other officials, some of whom claimed to have knowledge of how the body had been disposed of. Several officials alleged, without tabling evidence, that Khashoggi had first been tortured.

Officials believe that a team of 15 Saudis arrived on Tuesday to conduct the killing, then left the country soon afterwards.

The president, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, is expected to release a statement about the incident on Sunday. Aside from summonsing the Saudi ambassador in Ankara, senior officials had remained mute about Khashoggi’s fate, leading to speculation that he had been smuggled out of the country with Turkish consent.

The dramatic Turkish claim instead squarely focuses attentions on Riyadh, in particular Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, who on Friday denied any knowledge of Khashoggi’s whereabouts. “If he was here, I would know about it,” the 33-year-old heir to the throne told Bloomberg.

“My understanding is, he entered and he got out after a few minutes or one hour,” said Prince Mohammed. “I’m not sure. We are investigating this through the foreign ministry to see exactly what happened at that time.

“We are ready to welcome the Turkish government to go and search our premises. The premises are sovereign territory, but we will allow them to enter and search and do whatever they want to do. If they ask for that, of course, we will allow them.”

Earlier on Saturday, a Saudi official had dismissed claims that Khashoggi was still inside the consulate and said authorities were “very concerned for his safety”.

Khashoggi had been close to the previous Saudi regime, but fled the kingdom a year ago, soon after the new monarch anointed his son, Prince Mohammed, as prince. He subsequently became an outspoken critic of some aspects of the country’s reform programme, especially the clampdown on political freedoms, and intolerance of dissent.

Khashoggi had a regular column for the Washington Post and had also written for the Guardian. He had sought assurances about his safety from Saudi officials before entering the consulate to sign the divorce papers, a necessary step for him to marry his Turkish fiance, who was waiting for him outside.

Sun Oct 07 05:47:49
Sun Oct 07 09:41:33
"Khashoggi had a regular column for the Washington Post and had also written for the Guardian."

Nothing of value was lost then.
Sun Oct 07 11:35:51
^ wants Saudi Barbaria and ISIS to win.
Sun Oct 07 11:40:11
Rugian loves breitbart cock.
Tue Oct 09 02:36:13
I'm expecting Britain, the EU and USA to condemn Saudi Barbaria for the suspected barbaric murder and dismemberment of the journalist, like they condemned Russia for a murder attempt, and to impose sanctions on Saudi Barbaria like they did to Russia based on strong suspicions.
Tue Oct 09 10:27:49
I expect us to be very very angry. And we will write them a letter, telling them how angry we are.
Tue Oct 09 10:38:02
Probably better to just glass them.
Tue Oct 09 10:44:24
Does glassing destroy the oil though?

"^ wants Saudi Barbaria and ISIS to win."

WaPo is far more dangerous to our country than either of those guys.
Tue Oct 09 10:59:42
What's wrong with bottles instead of barrels? Call it red rocket gas.
Wed Oct 10 08:28:37
lol, Trump is ISIS:

President Trump seldom waits for the facts before rendering judgment. But when it comes to the disappearance of Post contributor Jamal Khashoggi, allegedly killed by Saudi Arabia in Turkey, Trump has been strangely reticent.

Vice President Pence reacted by denouncing “violence against journalists” and said, “The free world deserves answers,” while Republicans in Congress warned that relations with Saudi Arabia would be rethought. The State Department backed an investigation.

But there was no outraged statement from the president, no summoning of the Saudi ambassador for an explanation. It didn’t even rise to the level of a tweet.

In the Oval Office on Tuesday, as Trump accepted U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Nikki Haley’s resignation, reporters asked if he had spoken to the Saudis about it.

“No, I have not, but I will be at some point,” he said.

At some point? Please do, Mr. President, if it’s not too much trouble. The Saudi journalist, who had been living in Virginia, disappeared last week, and The Post reported Saturday that Turkish officials believe he was murdered in the Istanbul consulate of our supposed ally Saudi Arabia.

Read all of it here: http://www...ry.html?utm_term=.694ed3a55e13
Wed Oct 10 08:49:23
If things that Rugian considered "not of value" were all destroyed, the entire world would consist of his small village of inbred white hillbillies, his pokemon card collection, and his blacked.com porn stash.
Wed Oct 10 22:47:23
Its starting to look like the US is gonna have to hammer our "Allies". Apparently US Intelligence intercepted communications about the plan to nab Khashoggi. The US Senate has decided to invoke the Magnitsky Act and is ordering an investigation to prep for sanctions.

Wed Oct 10 23:12:00
Did the Saudis get an explicit ok from the us administration, or did they calculated that they now have enough cover in DC (Jared Kucshner) to just do it, and then ride out the storm. No way they would dare to pull off assassination like that without some cover
Wed Oct 10 23:59:46
Honestly? They are an absolute monarchy being run by a prince regent. The dude has no more idea how the real world works then any other pampered rich ass hole.

Fact is though using a consulate to lure in and murder someone in a country not your own is a huge breach of international law. The only relief here is that it happened while the dude was in Turkey rather then in Washington DC. The diplomatic fiasco that would have caused would have been unpleasant. You might have even seen the FBI given a presidential order to raid a consulate. Consulates cannot be used for activities outside their diplomatic function. Like say, murdering dissidents.

That said, the Saudis are probably going to get a slap on the wrist. Maybe a ban on arms sales too.
Average Ameriacn
Thu Oct 11 01:29:41
When Arabs kill each other we should not get involved.
Thu Oct 11 03:50:20
Except when Syrians kill each others?
Thu Oct 11 11:05:13
Whataboutism time!


Turkey abducted Erdogan opponents in Kosovo
FOCUS ON EUROPE | 17.05.2018 | 04:08 mins.



Turkey’s intelligence service abducts 2 people from Azerbaijan and Ukraine over Gülen links

By SCF - July 12, 2018



Turkey’s spy agency has secretly abducted 80 Turkish citizens living abroad

By Alexa Liautaud Apr 10, 2018

Thu Oct 11 11:40:34
I guess we are only going to see more of this. States will abduct and torture and kill people as they see fit more often in the future. It doesn’t matter in which country you are at, the enemy State will get you.

We have seen how the US has abducted people to be imprisoned and tortured without a charge, how they have killed people in drone strikes.

Israel too has abducted people from other countries. Even murdered people in other countries like Norway and Iran. Israel even helped Turkey to abduct the kurdish leader of the PKK from Latin America.

Russia has certainly done similar things. Recently in Britain.

China has abducted one of its own citizens (dual Swedish-Chinese citizenship) from Thailand or was it from Vietnam?

Perhaps we should stop being outraged about this, and stop pretending that international laws are something that is important and just let States abduct and kill people as they please. Perhaps we should also scrap democracy. If we want to compete with China and Russia, Saudi Barbaria and Israel we will have to compete on equal terms. So democracy has to go. We are seeing how democratic values and ideals are being eroded and scrapped in the US already.
Anarchist Prime
Thu Oct 11 18:00:16
Turks Had Saudi Consulate Bugged With Audio: Khashoggi Death Chronology Details Leaked

Fri Oct 12 09:30:06

Abduction is bad, but can normally be finessed as "he came with us voluntarily".

Torture, murder, butcher, and sneaking out the dismembered parts in diplomatic vehicles is, I think, totally unprecedented.
Fri Oct 12 14:21:13
Gonna have to agree with Seb for a change. The Saudis really can't be allowed to get away with this. Sadly I think Trump intends exactly that.
Hot Rod
Revved Up
Fri Oct 12 14:33:22

There is now **proof** that he was tortured and murdered.

Turkey shared the proof with US Intelligence.

Fri Oct 12 14:49:33
I hope the Saudis launch a preemptive attack on Turkey for bugging their embassy.

Two theocratic Islamist shitholes going at it?

We can only win.
Fri Oct 12 14:50:43
Saudi Barbaria tortured and murdered him ISIS-style. Just watch as Trump is going to make excuses and defend Barbaria and continue to send weapons to them.
Hot Rod
Revved Up
Fri Oct 12 15:49:43

Of course, we are going to sell them weapons.

We have a $115,000,000,000 deal with them right now.

What would you do?

Politely tell SA that they did a naughty thing that you do not approve of so they will just have to buy their weapons from China or Russia.

Come to think of it, you probably would.

Fri Oct 12 16:00:46
I'd sell them to Assad and laugh at their whining.
the wanderer
Fri Oct 12 18:05:08
supposedly the suspected dead guy transmitted audio or something about what was happening via his iWatch
Fri Oct 12 18:12:20
Saudis so dumb

Hot Rod too but whatever
the wanderer
Fri Oct 12 18:55:13
Trump has made it clear he will continue all arms sales & taking bribes at his hotels

business is business
Anarchist Prime
Fri Oct 12 19:42:56
Yemeni civilians getting killed is kosher.
al qaeda sympathizer journalist maybe got wacked,not halal.
just like under obama.
Hot Rod
Revved Up
Fri Oct 12 22:50:15

Pillz is another one that would tell SA to buy their weapons somewhere else.

He doesn't have much business sense.

tw, do you realize that you tell a helluva lot more lies than Trump ever has.

the wanderer
Sat Oct 13 00:43:00
Trump's arms sales comment is on video

Saudis spending heaps at Trump's New York, Chicago, & DC hotels is in the real news

large member
Sat Oct 13 04:07:43
May I remind you what nationalities Bin Laden and the 9-11 high-jackers held?

Saudi Arabia can harm you plenty.
Sat Oct 13 04:13:19
Will Russia stop selling weapons to Saudi-Arabia? They even help SA to build their own weapons:


In October [2017], Russia sealed a range of arms contracts with Saudi Arabia. The deals include the supply of S-400 anti-aircraft missile systems, anti-tank guided missiles, heavy flame systems, grenade launchers as well as Kalashnikov AK-103 assault rifles. The parties also agreed to start licensed production of Kalashnikov AK-103 assault rifles in Saudi Arabia.
Sat Oct 13 04:15:43
"I'd sell them to Assad and laugh at their whining."

But how would he pay for them?
Sun Oct 14 10:11:16
Look, no one is saying that what SA did isn't bad. But until we know more about the recording, this stands an equal chance of Saudis being grossly incompetent at abductions vs. a willful case of premeditated murder.

Meanwhile, the Saudi-UAE coalition just wiped out a bunch of civilians in Yemen. No one is calling for sanctions over that though, since that's apparently "acceptable" behavior.
Sun Oct 14 11:58:48
It is acceptable behavior for the USA, and for the rest of those who are allied with Saudi-UAE.
Sun Oct 14 12:57:49
Rugian: not sure it makes a difference.

Abduction isn't consular services so it's a huge abuse whatever.

The ultimate intent here doesn't matter.

Sun Oct 14 13:36:15
Rugian: simple mathematics - third world citizens < a known journalist that worked for a US publication.
Sun Oct 14 14:46:34
"May I remind you what nationalities Bin Laden and the 9-11 high-jackers held?

Saudi Arabia can harm you plenty."

Only due to the weak stomachs of Westerners.

Saudi Arabia could be glassed in a day, and we'll live without their oil.
the wanderer
Mon Oct 15 11:09:51
"Just spoke to the King of Saudi Arabia who denies any knowledge of whatever may have happened “to our Saudi Arabian citizen.” He said that they are working closely with Turkey to find answer. I am immediately sending our Secretary of State to meet with King!"
~ Trump tweet (presumably emphasizing 'saudi citizen' so as not to say our citizen)

& he said:
"it sounded to me like maybe these could have been rogue killers. Who knows?"

so it's Putin all over again, believe what the people who praise/pamper/pay you say
the wanderer
Mon Oct 15 11:12:28
also from Trump:

"His denial to me could not have been stronger that he had no knowledge. And it sounded like he, and also the Crown Prince, had no knowledge."
"The denial was very, very strong."

Putin's denial was strong too... very strong...
Wed Oct 17 09:20:37
‘He had this guy murdered’: Sen. Lindsey Graham blames Saudi crown prince for missing journalist

Sen. Lindsey O. Graham (R-S.C.) on Tuesday accused the crown prince of Saudi Arabia, Mohammed bin Salman, of having Washington Post columnist Jamal Khashoggi killed and said, “This guy has got to go.”

Graham’s comments, on Fox News Channel’s “Fox & Friends,” were far less cautious than those of President Trump, who said in a pair of tweets Tuesday afternoon that the crown prince had “totally denied any knowledge” of what happened in the Saudi Consulate in Istanbul and promised answers “shortly.”

Khashoggi disappeared after a visit to the consulate two weeks ago.

“He had this guy murdered in the consulate in Turkey. Expect me to ignore it? I feel used and abused,” Graham said, referring to his previous advocacy for Saudi Arabia as a senator. “I was on the floor every time defending Saudi Arabia because they are a good ally.”

Graham then suggested King Salman should choose another prince to be Saudi Arabia’s presumptive leader.

“This MBS figure to me is toxic,” Graham said, referring to the crown prince, who is widely known by his initials. “He can never be a world leader on the world stage . . . This guy has got to go. Saudi Arabia, if you’re listening, there are a lot of good people you can choose, but MBS has tainted your country and tainted himself.”

The Washington Post reported last week that the crown prince had ordered an operation to lure Khashoggi back to Saudi Arabia from his home in Virginia and then detain him, according to U.S. intelligence intercepts of Saudi officials discussing the plan.

Trump has been hesitant to blame Saudi leaders. In tweets Tuesday afternoon, Trump said he had just spoken with the crown prince, “who totally denied any knowledge of what took place in their Turkish Consulate.”

He added the prince “told me that he has already started, and will rapidly expand, a full and complete investigation into this matter. Answers will be forthcoming shortly.”

Shortly after Trump’s tweets, Sen. Jeff Flake (R-Ariz.) opined that Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin “should not be going to Riyadh,” where he is scheduled to attend an investment conference next week.

A growing number of media companies, including CNN, have announced they will no longer participate in the event, which is scheduled to start Oct. 23.

Speaking to reporters Monday after talking to the king, Trump suggested “rogue killers” could have been responsible for Khashoggi’s death.

Trump made his comments as he announced he was dispatching Secretary of State Mike Pompeo to Saudi Arabia and pledged, “We’re going to try getting to the bottom of it very soon.”

During an interview Tuesday on Bloomberg TV, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) sounded a cautious note, saying lawmakers need to find out what happened before crafting a response.

Wed Oct 17 12:14:40
Ah yes, we tortured him too far and he died, naturally we were ashamed of this so we chopped him up and sent him back to Saudia Barbaria in a box. Surprisingly, this is palatable diplomatically.
Wed Oct 17 12:22:23
Audio Contains Gruesome Details of Khashoggi Killing, Turkish Official Says

ISTANBUL — His killers were waiting when Jamal Khashoggi walked into the Saudi consulate in Istanbul two weeks ago. They severed his fingers during an interrogation and later beheaded and dismembered him, according to details from audio recordings published in the Turkish news media on Wednesday.

It was all over within a few minutes, the recordings suggested.

A senior Turkish official confirmed the details that were published in the pro-government daily newspaper Yeni Safak.

The leaking of such details, on the same day Secretary of State Mike Pompeo was visiting Turkey, reflected an escalation of pressure by the Turkish government on Saudi Arabia and the United States for answers on the fate of Mr. Khashoggi, a prominent dissident journalist who wrote for The Washington Post.

Fifteen days after he entered the consulate in Istanbul and was never seen coming out, the Saudis have yet to give an explanation.

Top Saudi officials have repeatedly denied any involvement in Mr. Khashoggi’s disappearance — denials that they repeated to Mr. Pompeo when he visited Saudi Arabia on Tuesday.

A team of 15 Saudi agents, some with ties to Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, was waiting for Mr. Khashoggi inside the Saudi consulate the moment he arrived, at about 1:15 p.m. on Oct. 2.

[Read about the agents who also have been seen in the crown prince’s security detail.]

After he was shown into the office of the Saudi consul, Mohammad al-Otaibi, the agents seized Mr. Khashoggi almost immediately and began to beat and torture him, eventually cutting off his fingers, the senior Turkish official said.

“Do this outside. You will put me in trouble,” Mr. al-Otaibi, the consul, told them, according to the Turkish official and the report in Yeni Safak, both citing audio recordings said to have been obtained by Turkish intelligence.

“If you want to live when you come back to Arabia, shut up,” one of the agents replied, according to both the official and the newspaper.

“Horrendous tortures were committed on Khashoggi, who came to the consulate for documents,” the Yeni Safak account said.

As they cut off Mr. Khashoggi’s head and dismembered his body, a doctor of forensics who had been brought along for the dissection and disposal had some advice for the others, according to the senior Turkish official.

Listen to music, he told them, as he put on headphones himself. That was what he did to ease the tension when doing such work, the official said, describing the contents of the audio recording.


There is no doubt that Mohammed bin Salam and ISIS are on of the same. And Trump and USA loves them.
Wed Oct 17 14:16:24
Trump is looking to save the face of Saudi Barbaria and the Crown Prince of ISIS.

Imagine what that vermin Trump would tweet if this was Obama doing it.
Wed Oct 17 19:31:07
Grahams involvement leads me to believe Israel was responsible
Thu Oct 18 02:52:33
Our president is such a spineless piece of shit.
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