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Utopia Talk / Politics / Member of the club!
Daemon
Member
Wed Jun 05 12:01:52
http://twitter.com/RoyalFamily/status/1136218825085607936
jergul
large member
Wed Jun 05 12:22:00
The Western Front was always a sideshow.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Bagration

The Germans lost 8 times more divisions there than the allies faced on D-day.

Rugian
Member
Wed Jun 05 12:25:54
D-Day involved putting the lives of actual civilized Westerners at risk, not just a multitude of worthless Slavic peasants. That's why it matters more.
Paramount
Member
Wed Jun 05 12:57:12
”D-Day involved putting the lives of actual civilized Westerners at risk”

Civilized westerners, you mean Liberals and Leftists. Because it was they he fought the far-right extremists on the beaches that day.
Im better then you
2012 UP Football Champ
Wed Jun 05 15:45:52
It was a German that eventually killed Hitler.
jergul
large member
Thu Jun 06 06:40:38
IBTY
An Austrian I think you meant.

Ruggy
You really think that?

14% German
11% Italian
10% UK
10% Ireland
9% Austria-Hungary
7% Russia

Why you even consider yourselves Westerners is beyond me.
jergul
large member
Thu Jun 06 07:15:55
Come to think of it, was not the war against imperial japan along the same lines?

What fraction of Japan's military was pre-occupied in China?
Rugian
Member
Thu Jun 06 07:24:50
Jergul

Since neither a header nor a link was provided, I can only assume that those numbers are war participant scores from your latest Vicky II run.
jergul
large member
Thu Jun 06 09:13:14
Ruggy
Migration to the US by nationality.
Rugian
Member
Thu Jun 06 11:37:53
In what year, 1907?
jergul
large member
Thu Jun 06 12:04:49
Over a century. European migration. The question still stands.
Forwyn
Member
Thu Jun 06 13:53:35
Why would Westerners who migrated even further West consider themselves Westerners?

lulz
Rugian
Member
Thu Jun 06 14:23:57
Jergul,

Given the presence of Austria-Hungary in your list, I feel it fair to be curious of which century we're actually talking about.

But as to your question. I'm not sure what it is, actually, unless I'm supposed to be super offended by the prospect of German-Anericans. And frankly, why would I be? The shitty Germans are the ones who stayed in your God-forsaken continent, not the ones who showed the entrepreneurial drive to come West.
Rugian
Member
Thu Jun 06 14:25:43
Same reason I'm fine with Norwegian-Americans, incidentally. Good, clean, Protestants who realized that Europe was dying and decided to move on to greener pastures.
CrownRoyal
Member
Thu Jun 06 14:59:00
"The shitty Germans are the ones who stayed in your God-forsaken continent, not the ones who showed the entrepreneurial drive to come West."

This doesn't sound right. Well, some were good people, I presume, with the entrepreneurial drive. But when countries send people to the US, they're not sending their best. They're sending people that have lots of problems. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists
jergul
large member
Thu Jun 06 15:04:49
Forwyn
Technically, you are east of the date line. Though I admit, there are portions of the US that align nicely with European values.

Mainly the portions Ruggy dislikes strongly.

Ruggy
The shitty ones are the ones that left. Huddled masses and all that.

You may want to visit Norwegian-Americans. A suprising number of them rank high on your list of famous mass murderers. Completely disproportionate.

Successful Norwegian migrants built their fortunes, then returned home and put their aquired capital to good use. Fully 1/3 did that.

CR
Send is probably the wrong word. Though Cuba did empty it jails. There is that counter example.
jergul
large member
Thu Jun 06 15:05:25
revisit your thoughts on Norwegian-Americans*
jergul
large member
Thu Jun 06 15:06:03
And East of the meant time line*
Rugian
Member
Thu Jun 06 15:36:40
Tfw SPQR is considered an eastern civilization because Rome is 12 Deg. 30' E.

Rofl jergul. Come on.
Rugian
Member
Thu Jun 06 15:41:08
Does France need to be reclassed as belonging to the orient as well? I never thought so, but Paris IS 2 Deg. 21' 03" E, so...
Rugian
Member
Thu Jun 06 15:43:06
Oslo: 10 Deg. 41' E

I never knew that Norway was considered to be a province of the Asiatics. The things we learn.
Rugian
Member
Thu Jun 06 15:46:03
Thanks God we at least get to keep Spain I guess. Althoguh maybe not Catalonia, Barcelona IS at 2 Deg 11'. Viva el indepentisme catala?
Forwyn
Member
Thu Jun 06 16:00:32
"Technically, you are east of the date line."

And West of the Greenwich Mean Timeline.

But sure, you go ahead with your jergulramblings™ that the Western Hemisphere is actually Eastern, and the Far East is actually the Far Middle.
jergul
large member
Thu Jun 06 16:05:55
Ruggy and Forwyn
You are simply not part of the western, democratic, humanist, liberal tradition.

We typically know that to be "Western".

But hell, you call yourselves by the name of not one, but two continents.

So why not annex "Western" too?

Or should we say "Anschulz" to reflect that the main population you stem from is in fact Germanic.
jergul
large member
Thu Jun 06 16:08:15
Anschluss*

Gah. A little gin is a dangerous thing.
Rugian
Member
Thu Jun 06 17:07:32
"You are simply not part of the western, democratic, humanist, liberal tradition."

We are the dictionary definition of such traditions. In fact, we are a holdover of the Enlightenment-era traditions that Europe have since turned its back on.

As for demographic makeup, British Americans are considered the largest combined group:

"The largest ancestries of American whites are: German Americans (17%), Irish Americans (12%), English Americans (9%), Italian Americans (6%), French Americans (4%), Polish Americans (3%), Scottish Americans (3%), Scotch-Irish Americans (2%), Dutch Americans (2%), Norwegian Americans (2%) and Swedish Americans (1%).[10][11][12] However, the English Americans and British Americans demography is considered a serious under-count as the stock tend to self-report and identify as simply "Americans" (7%), due to the length of time they have inhabited the United States, particularly if their family arrived prior to the American Revolution.[13] The vast majority of white Americans also have ancestry from multiple countries."

Not that theres anything wrong with German-Americans, of course. They're (mostly) Protestant, white, learn the language quickly, fit in well, and dont blow shopping malls and music concerts.
Rugian
Member
Thu Jun 06 17:12:52
I will concede that America is more a product of English philosophical traditions than any sort of general European-wide ideals.

Given that most of the rest of the continent had spent the bulk of the last half-millenia trying synthesize those ideals with justifications for absolute monarchies, I consider that a point of pride.

Absolute monarchy is at its core an oriental concept after all.
Forwyn
Member
Thu Jun 06 17:37:59
"You are simply not part of the western, democratic, humanist, liberal tradition."

Lulz. While the US was throwing off the shackles of monarchy and enshrining civil rights like speech that you still have a problem with in *current year*, Europe was busy turning the Indian subcontinent into its vichy state and forming mega-alliances against a state that was actually pushing humanist, liberal ideals.
jergul
large member
Fri Jun 07 01:43:17
Forwyn and Ruggy
You did not so much throw off the shackles of monarchy as codify it in your indirectly elected executive office, then froze that model in time anno 1788.

Trump is having more "fun" than Napoleon the 3rd ever had.

But point taken. Your country was quite progressive when the founding fathers froze it in the 18th century.
jergul
large member
Fri Jun 07 02:02:29
You are simply no longer part of the western, democratic, humanist, liberal tradition*
Pillz
Member
Fri Jun 07 14:39:34
That couldn't be more ironic even if tc or Arab said it
obaminated
Member
Fri Jun 07 23:09:20
jergul brings up a funny concept. do people in norway find pride in the fact that their betters left their shitty homeland to join and amalgamate into a country they viewed as better, all while being the ones left behind?

sort of like the trailer park family member taking pride in the family members that went to school and are now doing better... all while not doing anything to better their own position.
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