Utopia Talk - Politics - INCIDENT OF 3 JULY 1988

Welcome to the Utopia Forums! Register a new account
The current time is Fri May 29 20:42:49 2020

Utopia Talk / Politics / INCIDENT OF 3 JULY 1988

swordtail
Anarchist Prime Wed Jul 03 09:43:21
Iran Air Flight 655 was a scheduled passenger flight from Tehran to Dubai via Bandar Abbas, that was shot down on 3 July 1988 by an SM-2MR surface-to-air missile fired from USS Vincennes, a guided missile cruiser of the United States Navy. The aircraft, an Airbus A300, was destroyed and all 290 people on board, including 66 children, were killed.[1] The jet was hit while flying over Iran's territorial waters in the Persian Gulf, along the flight's usual route, shortly after departing Bandar Abbas International Airport, the flight's stopover location. Vincennes had entered Iranian territory after one of its helicopters drew warning fire from Iranian speedboats operating within Iranian territorial limits.[2][3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655

swordtail
Anarchist Prime Wed Jul 03 09:43:35
http://twitter.com/steffanwatkins/status/1146386597232992256

Paramount
Member Wed Jul 03 11:11:52
The USA are gangsters. Just saying.

Allahuakbar
Member Wed Jul 03 11:46:35
They will achieve nothing with it. If Iran shoots down their own planes then the passengers will all become martyrs, no harm done.
Usanian infidels just don't get it that we can never lose against them.

Sam Adams
Member Wed Jul 03 12:58:34
Muslims complaining about airliners being targeted? Lol ok.

Forwyn
Member Wed Jul 03 13:06:41
I mean, yeah, we spend a decade giving chemical weapons to Saddam to perpetrate a war of conquest, and when Iran starts mining gulf waters, we sink half their navy and trespass into their waters to shoot down their jetliners in their airspace, because we can't tell up from down and fail to squawk on civilian channels

Sam Adams
Member Wed Jul 03 13:24:07
Bandar Abbas is a joint use/military airfield and the aircraft was flying from there towards a us warship that was fighting iran at the time. It was pretty justifiable.

kargen
Member Wed Jul 03 13:34:17
One problem with your post Forwyn. The UN determined the chemical make-up of the weapons Iraq had matched those manufactured in France. Each country had their own unique blend for their chemical weapons so it was easy to determine where the chemical weapons came from.
There was one other country in Europe that used a near copy of what the French used so the UN didn't completely rule out the weapons came from that country.

Forwyn
Member Wed Jul 03 13:58:38
The aircraft was ascending in an internationally recognized civilian air corridor in the general direction of a warship trespassing in Iranian territorial waters*

fixed

Sam Adams
Member Wed Jul 03 14:11:17
"The aircraft was ascending in an internationally recognized civilian air corridor"

So? An iranian plane with hostile intent couldnt do that?

Forwyn
Member Wed Jul 03 14:37:27
Sure. So once they

a) begin descending,
b) ignore squawking (civilian jetliner did not, but clearly they were not on military channels),
c) leave Iranian airspace,

It's a clean shoot

Sam Adams
Member Wed Jul 03 15:10:40
a) utterly irrelevant. an aircraft does not need to be descending to attack.
b) this means nothing. an enemy aircraft could easily transmit a fake transponder signal with. Futhermore muslims use commercial airliners as weapons.
c)irrelevent. The iranians had attacked the cruisers helo, giving the cruiser the moral and legal right to enter iranian waters to hunt the attackers. The cruiser gave the plane ample chances to respond to radio messages, and then correctly killed it after it failed to do so.

It was a clean shoot. If i am captain or weapons officer, im 100% killing that plane. Im engaged in battle with iranian gunboats and a bogey lifts off from one of irans chief military airports and heads in my direction? Easy fucking choice. Kill it.

Forwyn
Member Wed Jul 03 15:23:35
a) Then why did the military insist for three years that the aircraft was descending in an attack pattern?

b) Naval personnel made earnest attempts to contact the jetliner. Much like their failure to delineate up from down, they also failed to account for time zone differences when checking airliner schedules. Further, they were not properly equipped for ATC communications, something that has since been addressed.

"Futhermore muslims use commercial airliners as weapons."

Well, Sunnis do - including the Stark incident, in which we blamed Iranians even though it was an Iraqi incident. lulz

c) Reportedly, they received some small-arms fire from some retard on a motorboat. Given that they also lied about their positioning and the movements of the jet, that's dubious.

Not a malicious shootdown - just improperly equipped retarded enlistees, compounded by a couple decades of retarded foreign policy.

Sam Adams
Member Wed Jul 03 15:32:26
"Then why did the military insist for three years that the aircraft was descending in an attack pattern?"

PR idiocy?

Sam Adams
Member Wed Jul 03 15:46:26
Certainly the us navy could have been more forthcoming in their public response.

More importantly, iran could have not dispatched an airliner from a military airfield into a battle zone with a fucking deadly aegis missile destroyer. Thats like opening the door and letting your poodle out when a grizzly bear is in your yard.

Forwyn
Member Wed Jul 03 16:02:49
I think it's fairly less reasonable to expect for the civilian airport to be aware that some speedboat had fired on an overextended helicopter, than for an intruding ship to account for their being on Bahraini time. They probably made the routine half-hour flight to Dubai and back ten times a day.

jergul
large member Wed Jul 03 16:22:39
I think 1988 is a long time ago.

Forwyn
Member Wed Jul 03 17:07:18
So is 1953, but we're still dealing with the blowback.

swordtail
Anarchist Prime Wed Jul 03 18:28:54
July 03, 2019

On Eve Of 4th Of July Parade U.S. Attempts To Lure Iran Into Shooting Down Another U.S. Plane

http://www...own-another-us-plane.html#more

Nekran
Member Wed Jul 03 22:57:17
No surprise that Sammy would defend a retarded use of violence.

Luckily for all of us, even the US military saw he was unfit.

show deleted posts

swordtail Anarchist Prime	Wed Jul 03 09:43:21 Iran Air Flight 655 was a scheduled passenger flight from Tehran to Dubai via Bandar Abbas, that was shot down on 3 July 1988 by an SM-2MR surface-to-air missile fired from USS Vincennes, a guided missile cruiser of the United States Navy. The aircraft, an Airbus A300, was destroyed and all 290 people on board, including 66 children, were killed.[1] The jet was hit while flying over Iran's territorial waters in the Persian Gulf, along the flight's usual route, shortly after departing Bandar Abbas International Airport, the flight's stopover location. Vincennes had entered Iranian territory after one of its helicopters drew warning fire from Iranian speedboats operating within Iranian territorial limits.[2][3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655
swordtail Anarchist Prime	Wed Jul 03 09:43:35 http://twitter.com/steffanwatkins/status/1146386597232992256
Paramount Member	Wed Jul 03 11:11:52 The USA are gangsters. Just saying.
Allahuakbar Member	Wed Jul 03 11:46:35 They will achieve nothing with it. If Iran shoots down their own planes then the passengers will all become martyrs, no harm done. Usanian infidels just don't get it that we can never lose against them.
Sam Adams Member	Wed Jul 03 12:58:34 Muslims complaining about airliners being targeted? Lol ok.
Forwyn Member	Wed Jul 03 13:06:41 I mean, yeah, we spend a decade giving chemical weapons to Saddam to perpetrate a war of conquest, and when Iran starts mining gulf waters, we sink half their navy and trespass into their waters to shoot down their jetliners in their airspace, because we can't tell up from down and fail to squawk on civilian channels
Sam Adams Member	Wed Jul 03 13:24:07 Bandar Abbas is a joint use/military airfield and the aircraft was flying from there towards a us warship that was fighting iran at the time. It was pretty justifiable.
kargen Member	Wed Jul 03 13:34:17 One problem with your post Forwyn. The UN determined the chemical make-up of the weapons Iraq had matched those manufactured in France. Each country had their own unique blend for their chemical weapons so it was easy to determine where the chemical weapons came from. There was one other country in Europe that used a near copy of what the French used so the UN didn't completely rule out the weapons came from that country.
Forwyn Member	Wed Jul 03 13:58:38 The aircraft was ascending in an internationally recognized civilian air corridor in the general direction of a warship trespassing in Iranian territorial waters* fixed
Sam Adams Member	Wed Jul 03 14:11:17 "The aircraft was ascending in an internationally recognized civilian air corridor" So? An iranian plane with hostile intent couldnt do that?
Forwyn Member	Wed Jul 03 14:37:27 Sure. So once they a) begin descending, b) ignore squawking (civilian jetliner did not, but clearly they were not on military channels), c) leave Iranian airspace, It's a clean shoot
Sam Adams Member	Wed Jul 03 15:10:40 a) utterly irrelevant. an aircraft does not need to be descending to attack. b) this means nothing. an enemy aircraft could easily transmit a fake transponder signal with. Futhermore muslims use commercial airliners as weapons. c)irrelevent. The iranians had attacked the cruisers helo, giving the cruiser the moral and legal right to enter iranian waters to hunt the attackers. The cruiser gave the plane ample chances to respond to radio messages, and then correctly killed it after it failed to do so. It was a clean shoot. If i am captain or weapons officer, im 100% killing that plane. Im engaged in battle with iranian gunboats and a bogey lifts off from one of irans chief military airports and heads in my direction? Easy fucking choice. Kill it.
Forwyn Member	Wed Jul 03 15:23:35 a) Then why did the military insist for three years that the aircraft was descending in an attack pattern? b) Naval personnel made earnest attempts to contact the jetliner. Much like their failure to delineate up from down, they also failed to account for time zone differences when checking airliner schedules. Further, they were not properly equipped for ATC communications, something that has since been addressed. "Futhermore muslims use commercial airliners as weapons." Well, Sunnis do - including the Stark incident, in which we blamed Iranians even though it was an Iraqi incident. lulz c) Reportedly, they received some small-arms fire from some retard on a motorboat. Given that they also lied about their positioning and the movements of the jet, that's dubious. Not a malicious shootdown - just improperly equipped retarded enlistees, compounded by a couple decades of retarded foreign policy.
Sam Adams Member	Wed Jul 03 15:32:26 "Then why did the military insist for three years that the aircraft was descending in an attack pattern?" PR idiocy?
Sam Adams Member	Wed Jul 03 15:46:26 Certainly the us navy could have been more forthcoming in their public response. More importantly, iran could have not dispatched an airliner from a military airfield into a battle zone with a fucking deadly aegis missile destroyer. Thats like opening the door and letting your poodle out when a grizzly bear is in your yard.
Forwyn Member	Wed Jul 03 16:02:49 I think it's fairly less reasonable to expect for the civilian airport to be aware that some speedboat had fired on an overextended helicopter, than for an intruding ship to account for their being on Bahraini time. They probably made the routine half-hour flight to Dubai and back ten times a day.
jergul large member	Wed Jul 03 16:22:39 I think 1988 is a long time ago.
Forwyn Member	Wed Jul 03 17:07:18 So is 1953, but we're still dealing with the blowback.
swordtail Anarchist Prime	Wed Jul 03 18:28:54 July 03, 2019 On Eve Of 4th Of July Parade U.S. Attempts To Lure Iran Into Shooting Down Another U.S. Plane http://www...own-another-us-plane.html#more
Nekran Member	Wed Jul 03 22:57:17 No surprise that Sammy would defend a retarded use of violence. Luckily for all of us, even the US military saw he was unfit.
	show deleted posts

Your Name:
Your Password:
Your Message: