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Utopia Talk / Politics / Right-winger shoots up Walmart
Paramount
Member
Sat Aug 03 14:30:58
Right-winger shoots up Walmart in El Paso. Many dead.

Apparantly there’s a manifesto of some kind:

BREAKING: FBI investigating possible manifesto from the shooter which starts with the following two sentences: "In general, I support the Christchurch shooter and his manifesto. This attack is a response to the Hispanic invasion of Texas"

http://mob...man/status/1157728874513367040
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Sat Aug 03 14:34:52
^she notes it may not be the shooter

supposedly 3 suspects in custody (although it's Texas, could be lots of gunmen just walking around)
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Sat Aug 03 14:39:25
scratch that, police briefing now saying just 1 in custody
Paramount
Member
Sat Aug 03 14:40:10
"America will soon become a one party-state. The
Democrat party will own America and they know it. They have already begun the transition by pandering heavily to the Hispanic voting bloc in the 1st Democratic Debate."

"Although the Republican Party is also terrible. Many factions within the Republican Party are pro-corporation. Procorporation = pro-immigration. But some factions within the Republican Party don’t prioritize corporations over our future"

"My ideology has not changed for several years. My opinions on automation, immigration, and the rest predate Trump and his campaign for president. I putting this here because some people will blame the President...for the attack. This is not the case. "

^ definitevly pro-Trump, although he doesn’t want the blame to be put on Trump. (So the shooter is kind of protecting Trump).
Daemon
Member
Sat Aug 03 14:43:49
Was there a live stream, too?
Paramount
Member
Sat Aug 03 14:48:41
CNN has a video of a hispanic who is running with her shopping bags.

http://edi...us/el-paso-shooting/index.html
State Department
Member
Sat Aug 03 17:55:21
~20 dead is a slow summertime weekend in Chicago.
State Department
Member
Sat Aug 03 18:06:13
"If we can get rid of enough people, then our way of life can become more sustainable."

Thanos?
Paramount
Member
Sun Aug 04 01:41:17
Any chance that Trump will declare it a racist terror attack?
jergul
large member
Sun Aug 04 02:02:16
The scary thing was the immediate call-out for blood donors. WTF? Or not. Depending on what development status you assign the USA.
jergul
large member
Sun Aug 04 02:13:24
20 dead is a slow weekend in Syria SD.
patom
Member
Sun Aug 04 05:25:51
Dayton Ohio, 9 dead and a bunch wounded less that half a day after the Wal Mart slaughter. There will be no trial for this shooter. Police took care of that.
Dukhat
Member
Sun Aug 04 05:54:39
Time for people that actually have a little bit of empathy in the United States to do our part.

They are a vast majority in the country even if they are barely represented on this board.
Rugian
Member
Sun Aug 04 09:36:39
Dukhat has right. The government is way overdue in implementing rigorous speech control to stop the proliferation of copycat shooters. Let's face it, the First Amendment is a product of a long-bygone age, and its applicability in the 21st century is limited at best.

To start with, any media company or individual should have to apply for a license to broadcast the news, for which it must show a capability to report on mass shootings in a responsible manner. Making media companies civilly liable for mass shootings due to irresponsible reporting would also be a good step. And, of course, we need to ban certain forms of media that have proven to be especially damaging to our society, such as 24/7 cable news and outrage clickbait.

Constitutional rights are so passe. If we need to start saving lives, it's time to abolish them.
Dukhat
Member
Sun Aug 04 09:58:56
Blah blah blah. We'll implement universal background checks and pass some laws like Australia. Responsible gun-owners will still have guns and deaths will go down and

STUPID DUMB FUCKING WORTHLESS PIECES OF SHIT

like Rugian will find something else to complain about.

Do us all a favor and kill yourself before then, Rugian.
Forwyn
Member
Sun Aug 04 10:00:52
"universal background checks"

Is there any indication that this kid bought his AK at a gun show?
Paramount
Member
Sun Aug 04 10:12:56
http://abc...uns-mulvaney/story?id=64744298

"This was a sick person, the person in Dayton was a sick person," Mulvaney told ABC News Chief White House Correspondent Jonathan Karl, during an interview Sunday. "No politician is to blame for that. The person who was responsible here are the people who pulled the trigger.

So if politicians can’t be blamed, but only the one who pulls the trigger – that means Adolf Hitler was innocent, right? As far as I know he didn’t pull any trigger.
Rugian
Member
Sun Aug 04 10:28:31
"and pass some laws like Australia."

You mean pass a gun ban? Nice job trying to sneak that one in, shithead.
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Sun Aug 04 15:20:10
"
Congress should enact Red Flag laws/ Extreme Risk Protection Orders in EVERY state and increase resources dedicated to mental health support.
"
~Ivanka is coming for your guns
Hrothgar
Member
Sun Aug 04 16:05:43
Anyone else find it of interest that in today's mass media infused world the happenings any specific horrible event is quietly cheered by whichever political ideal feels like the horrible event proves them correct?

There is a total disconnect from the humanity surrounding an event. It's all framed from the perspective of "Does this make me feel like I am right and 'they' are wrong"?
Paramount
Member
Sun Aug 04 16:32:50
Yup. I feel like it was better back when Twitter, Facebook and Instagram didn’t exist.
Paramount
Member
Sun Aug 04 16:34:44
”Addressing reporters in Morristown, New Jersey, Trump said Sunday that “we’re going to take care” of the problem. He says he’s been speaking to the attorney general, FBI director and members of Congress and will be making an additional statement Monday.”


Trump himself may also be coming for your guns. Trump and Ivanka together. They will ”take care of the problem”. #MAGA
Forwyn
Member
Sun Aug 04 16:46:52
"any specific horrible event is quietly cheered by whichever political ideal feels like the horrible event proves them correct"

ANOTHER VIOLENT RIGHT-WINGER! WE STAND WITH OUR LATINO IMMIGRANT COMMUNITY!
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Sun Aug 04 17:20:49
Trump:
"We're talking to a lot of people and a lot of things are in the works and a lot of good things. And we've done much more than most administrations. And it is just not really talked about very much, but we've done actually a lot. But perhaps more has to be done.

But this is also a mental illness problem if you look at both of those cases. This is mental illness. These are really people that are very, very seriously mentally ill.

So a lot of things are happening. A lot of things are happening right now, and I will see you tomorrow at 10:00. Thank you."
-----

got that? a lot of good things have happened and are happening... take out the mentally ill part (by which i mean the part where he's talking about mental illness) & it's a standard Trump response to anything
Sam Adams
Member
Sun Aug 04 21:08:46
"I feel like it was better back when Twitter, Facebook and Instagram didn’t exist."

Nah. This is the safest time to be alive.
Cherub Cow
Member
Mon Aug 05 00:48:24
[Hrothgar]: "Anyone else find it of interest that in today's mass media infused world the happenings any specific horrible event is quietly cheered by whichever political ideal feels like the horrible event proves them correct?"

Partisan news networks sell that narrative, so it's consumed. It's also an issue because politicians have statements prepared and waiting for the next big shooting when they can use emotions to make their next move. It's sort of like how the obituaries of celebrities are already written so that networks can be the first ones to publish when that celebrity finally dies. It kills the spontaneity. You'd think shooters would recognize that fact and realize that they're not even that important; a simple suicide would have been fine, thanks, shooter.

..
[Hrothgar]: "There is a total disconnect from the humanity surrounding an event. It's all framed from the perspective of "Does this make me feel like I am right and 'they' are wrong"?"

Social media peeps have been trying to do mini-obituaries on the victims to bring some humanity into it, but the victims tend not to be too interesting. It's usually like..

Jared Fogle (1977-2019). He loved sandwiches and children. He was on a diet, but still didn't look very good and you know he probably had stretch marks.

Cleevus Stickboat Junior III (1980-2019). A regular at "Chuck's Tater Tots and Live Nudes", Cleevus held the 5th place record for largest catfish caught on a day hotter than 80 °F.

Katherine Plainlife (1995-2019). She had recently graduated with an Associate's Degree in Unexceptional Futures from Daleside Community College in Newtmouth, Iowa.

Nunchucks "Monster-Chugger" Porkchop (1999-2019). A frequent Call of Duty player, Nunchucks liked rhyming words with "Tigger" and once went three weeks consuming nothing but Monster Energy Drink and Cheetos.

Barrymeth Cleansuit (1975-2019). A primary school teacher of introductory finger painting, Barrymeth spent most of his time at leisure parking his R.V. in the wilderness and hanging out with the local chapter of the Nell's Bengals bike club.

Peggy McBureaucrat (1960-2019). Comptroller of district 4's environmental safety division, Peggy held the record for most consecutive vacation days during her workplace's busy season. In 2018 she was paid for an entire year of work while only working 50 days.

etc.
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Mon Aug 05 01:54:19
I now feel like I knew them
obaminated
Member
Mon Aug 05 02:52:55
i dunno if it is the safest time to be alive. i think social media is effecting people with mental disorders and because we are in the relative infancy of it we aren't fully aware of how bad it is to become famous on social media when you are a lunatic.
McKobb
Member
Mon Aug 05 03:12:44
Peggy works half the days I do...I feel gyped!
Average Ameriacn
Member
Mon Aug 05 09:09:59
Where can I donate for 8chan?

http://usa...bs-darkest-reaches/1917135001/


'Enough is enough': Cloudfare terminates 8chan, an online meeting place for 'extremist hate'
USA TODAY

Published 11:15 PM EDT Aug 4, 2019

The online message board 8chan, which has been linked to three mass shootings in 2019, will be terminated, Cloudfare announced late Sunday night, just hours after the site's founder called for its end.

Cloudfare will cut off services for 8chan at midnight PDT, CEO Matthew Prince said in a statement, though he noted that another network provider could bring 8chan back online. That's what happened in 2017, when Cloudfare booted The Daily Stormer, a neo-Nazi message board.

"The rationale is simple: they have proven themselves to be lawless and that lawlessness has caused multiple tragic deaths," Prince said. "Even if 8chan may not have violated the letter of the law in refusing to moderate their hate-filled community, they have created an environment that revels in violating its spirit."

During media interviews earlier Sunday, 8chan founder Fredrick Brennan called for the imageboard 's end.



“Shut the site down,” Brennan told the New York Times on Sunday. “It’s not doing the world any good. It’s a complete negative to everybody except the users that are there. And you know what? It’s a negative to them, too. They just don’t realize it.”

Founded as an alternative to the more well-known 4chan message board, 8chan, or "Infinite Chan," has nearly 20,000 public boards. The website's welcome is, "Welcome to 8chan, the Darkest Reaches of the Internet."

Many of the posts that could be quickly accessed prior to the website's termination included offensive images and language.

Saturday's shooting at a Walmart in El Paso, Texas, which left 20 dead and 26 injured, is the latest with a link to the website. The suspected gunman has been charged with capital murder and the crime is being investigated as a possible hate crime after the discovery of a racist manifesto on 8chan.

In March, a New Zealand man posted a lengthy manifesto to Twitter and to 8chan before killing 50 and injuring dozens in a rampage that was live-streamed on Facebook and Twitter.

In April, a shooter posted a manifesto to 8chan before killing one woman and injuring three others at a California synagogue.

The New York Times reported 8chan, "remained on the fringes until 2014, when some supporters of GamerGate — a loose reactionary collection of anti-feminist video gamers — flocked to 8chan after being kicked off 4chan.

By Sunday evening, the shooter's alleged manifesto was still circulating on 8chan.
A 'venomous' website for 'extremist hate'

In interviews with the Washington Post and the New York Times, Brennan said 8chan needs to be shut down. He gave up control of the website to Army veteran Jim Watkins in 2015, both newspapers reported.

“The board is a receptive audience for domestic terrorists," Brennan told the Post.

The Washington Post called the website "one of the Web’s most venomous refuges for extremist hate."

One anonymous 8chan user, for example, praised the El Paso shooting in a thread, the Southern Poverty Law Center said in a news release.

“The motive and the manifesto have not been named the entire day. There weren’t even speculations. They are f------ SCARED.”
'But this isn't the end'

In a message at the top of its website, 8chan states, "only content that violates the Digital Millennium Copyright Act or other United States laws is deleted," from the imageboard and warns users that posts and boards are user-created and "do not represent the opinions of the 8chan administration."

Brennan told the Post that 8chan is a "vanity project" for Watkins that doesn't make much money. He also told the newspaper the website's servers are distributed around the world, which makes it difficult to take down.

It has also been protected from web-based attacks by Cloudflare, according to the Post. Cloudflare lawyer Douglas Kramer told the Post he worried dropping 8chan's protection would encourage "cyber vigilantism."

In its termination statement, Cloudfare said it feels uncomfortable "playing the role of content arbitrator" but called on technology companies to work with lawmakers on dealing with hate-filled sites.

"There comes a time when enough is enough," Prince said in a tweet with the termination statement. "But this isn't the end. We need to have a broader conversation about addressing the root causes of hate online."
Rugian
Member
Mon Aug 05 09:31:16
^Fucking insane. ISPs should not be in the business of acting as censors for the morality police.
Paramount
Member
Mon Aug 05 09:36:58
It wouldn’t be a problem if people didn’t use the site to promote terrorism, racism and hate.
Sam Adams
Member
Mon Aug 05 09:49:44
Lol trump is whining about video games and internets too.

Seems like no one likes free speech.
Paramount
Member
Mon Aug 05 10:34:46
Yeah, blame video games. Lol. That was popular to do in the 90’s or maybe in the 80’s even. Looks like Trump is a bit behind.
Paramount
Member
Mon Aug 05 10:51:30
So maybe Trump will call Bill Gates now and have him shut down the internet.


"We're losing a lot of people because of the internet," Trump said. "We have to see Bill Gates and a lot of different people that really understand what's happening. We have to talk to them about, maybe in certain areas, closing that internet up in some ways.

Somebody will say, 'Oh freedom of speech, freedom of speech.' These are foolish people."

http://www...ose-up-the-internet-bill-gates

Ouch... Trump thinks you are an idiot, Rugian. I’m sorry :(
Paramount
Member
Mon Aug 05 10:56:41
Rofl, why is Trump so dumb? You should have elected Bill Gates instead, since at least he understands what is happening (according to Trump himself).
Paramount
Member
Mon Aug 05 11:28:07
Trump doesn’t know where the shooting took place.

Toledo?

http://twi...tatus/1158403620842463232?s=21

Although, it must be hard to know what is happening when he spends all his days on the golf course.
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Mon Aug 05 11:32:50
presumably the person who wrote the teleprompter's words is to blame

and also why he gets zero credit for anything he said there

although his defenders will all cheer saying 'he condemned white supremacy, yay!'... such a low bar for the shit bag
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Mon Aug 05 15:27:40
ok, maybe it wasn't the teleprompter
http://pbs.twimg.com/media/EBOUdi0W4AAxth6?format=jpg
(posted by a White House reporter, so probably not a photoshop)
Forwyn
Member
Mon Aug 05 15:36:29
THE PRESIDENT: Today, as Americans, we grieve the brutal murder—a horrific massacre—of dozens of innocent people. We pray for their families, who are grasping for answers with broken hearts. We stand with the people of El Paso, who have endured a terrible attack on their city. Although it’s still early in the investigation, we know enough to say that this was an act of terror and an act of hate. And as Americans, we are united in grief, in outrage, and in resolve to defend our people.

I just finished a meeting with FBI Director Wray and my homeland security and national security advisors. The FBI is on the scene and leading the investigation, in partnership with local law enforcement. I’ve directed that the full resources of the federal government be made available for this investigation.

We are still learning all the facts. This is an open investigation. We’ve reached no definitive judgment on the precise motivations of the killer. The FBI is appropriately investigating this as an act of terrorism. And I’ve directed that we must spare no effort to determine what—if any—inspiration or association this killer may have had with terrorist groups. What is clear is that he was a person filled with hatred. Over the coming days, we’ll uncover why and how this happened, and we will go wherever the facts lead us.
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Mon Aug 05 15:55:04
was that bait for me? not sure what i'm supposed to leap on


here are the actual words Trump read off the teleprompter (except for Toledo... i'll assume the teleprompter had a lot fewer 'May God...'s at the end)
http://www...ump-mass-shootings-texas-ohio/
Forwyn
Member
Mon Aug 05 16:11:13
Yeah, looks like your link goes quite a bit further in condemning the ideology behind the shooting than the one I posted
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Mon Aug 05 16:51:21
what Trump reads off a teleprompter is meaningless

Obama released this statement
http://pbs.twimg.com/media/EBOm6wlWwActjM_?format=jpg

i can't say Obama didn't write all of it

i can say Trump couldn't write any of it
Forwyn
Member
Mon Aug 05 17:40:08
Maybe Obama had a change of heart, he seems very ready to condemn hateful ideologies that lead to terror attacks now
tumbleweed
the wanderer
Mon Aug 05 18:56:51
Trump doesn't give a shit about racism or white nationalists or gun violence

that's why his tweets today were 'it's fake news' fault, they should only praise me' and 'let's use these tragedies to get my wall built' (not his exact words, but what he meant)
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