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Utopia Talk / Politics / WHO-credible?
Habebe
Member
Sun Mar 29 03:24:12
Obviously world health isnt the best ATM. They offered some shotty tests ( limited).

Japan says the leader shpuld resign ( petition on change
Org)

They won't even acknowledge the word Taiwan.

Now They are praising Trump for his handling of the pandemic. Perhaps for not taking there shitty tests.

Wtf is going on with this place.
jergul
large member
Sun Mar 29 07:24:59
I think WHO should recognize both Taiwan and the Southern Confederacy.
jergul
large member
Sun Mar 29 07:26:05
Hell, it should recognize all US states and sovereign nations.

Sometimes you have to lead a horse to water.
jergul
large member
Sun Mar 29 07:26:35
as sovereign nations*

Many nations under God!
Habebe
Member
Sun Mar 29 07:54:04
There is a difference between recognizing a sovereign nation amd faking to nor hear a question.When asked if the question should be repeated the rep stuttered out a " no, just go to the next one"
The Children
Member
Sun Mar 29 07:57:30
nobody in the world recognizes taiwan other than u delusional cukcs, kid.

Average Ameriacn
Member
Sun Mar 29 08:01:32
Make Bolsonaro head of WHO.
jergul
large member
Sun Mar 29 08:06:52
Habebe
Both Taiwan and China have a one country policy. Why exactly do you want the WHO to stick its hand into thats hornets nest?

It would end poorly. Taiwan is not a member of the UN or its suborganizations like say the WHO.
jergul
large member
Sun Mar 29 08:08:26
Many nations under God would resolve a lot of your partisan differences.

You may want to think about it in earnest.
Habebe
Member
Sun Mar 29 08:22:46
Oh I didn't know that viruses respected borders. That's better than Mexicans.

We should disregard life saving information so we dont piss of China.

God forbid we lose out on ineffective tests and masks, what ever shall we do
?!
Wrath of Orion
Member
Sun Mar 29 08:49:00
Yes, they're credible. I see your full on retard switch has been engaged today. It should make for some interesting reads, thanks.
Habebe
Member
Sun Mar 29 08:51:12
Wrath, What about them makes them credible to you?
Wrath of Orion
Member
Sun Mar 29 08:58:00
Let's start with you providing evidence regarding issues with the tests the WHO adopted.

Are you referring to the erroneous citation of a study by the US government from China about false positives? That paper has been retracted, if you didn't know. That paper also refers to tests developed in China, while I'm pretty sure the WHO adopted a test developed in Germany.
Wrath of Orion
Member
Sun Mar 29 08:59:09
And yes, a change.org petition - always the best way to judge whether something is credible.

You're full on Retard Rod 2.0 today.
Wrath of Orion
Member
Sun Mar 29 09:02:53
As for Tedros praising Trump, I partially agree with him and partially disagree. There are things Trump is doing now that are good, and things he is still doing (or not doing) that are detrimental.

As a blanket statement to try to show solidarity and support, I don't have too much issue with it. That is important during times like this (something Trump and most politicians don't understand).
Wrath of Orion
Member
Sun Mar 29 09:03:21
And that takes care of all your claims - so yeah, fuck off, retard.
jergul
large member
Sun Mar 29 09:09:46
habebe
Covid-19 is not really a partisan issue. I was think about all the other issues that drive discussions.

Would President Trump of Florida care about the Deep State in President Coumo's New York?
Rugian
Member
Sun Mar 29 09:10:29
The Taiwan thing in particular is disgusting - Taiwan actually did a great job in handling the virus, they could have been an object lesson for the WHO to study. Unfortunately, China is an evil piece of shit and Taiwan got completely disregarded as a result.

Note also that some people are actually supporting China in this thread. They are disgusting people and their opinions should permanently be ignored as communist propaganda.
jergul
large member
Sun Mar 29 09:11:02
I am very fond of the USA, so fond in fact that I would prefer there to be 52 of them.
TJ
Member
Sun Mar 29 10:45:14
jergul:

You are becoming a habitual fonder for stimulation. It seems to be working. lmao
Dukhat
Member
Sun Mar 29 10:52:04
China fucked up pretty hard to begin with but these world organizations always have to tread carefully. They try to bend policies into the right directions instead of actually set them. The ultimate powers is with the countries themselves so getting locked out of a place like China would be bad for everyone.

China did the right thing even though it was a month too late. They locked down their country and released lots of useful i formation like the genome of the disease to the world.

Meanwhile, a bunch of knuckleheads across the West want to pretend this isn’t happening. Bolsonero, obrador, trump. All want to stick their head in the sand.
TJ
Member
Sun Mar 29 10:55:06
Soft power has been pretty successful.
CrownRoyal
Member
Sun Mar 29 11:44:04

“ Just finished a very good conversation with President Xi of China. Discussed in great detail the CoronaVirus that is ravaging large parts of our Planet. China has been through much & has developed a strong understanding of the Virus. We are working closely together. Much respect!”


http://twi...tatus/1243407157321560071?s=21


Stand down, Rugian.
Rugian
Member
Sun Mar 29 13:55:49
Sorry CR, now that Trump has riled me and my fellow mindless MAGA cultists into a racist-adjacent fury over the yellow peril, there's no putting that genie back in the bottle. No matter what anyone, including the president, says now, we're going to go on a rage-induced rampage against all of our Chinese neighbors, sparing none in the process.

For the sake of the bat-eaters, they should probably follow Dukhat's lead and buy as many guns as possible for defense. Otherwise, its ethnic cleansing time.
CrownRoyal
Member
Sun Mar 29 14:29:04
Ok, fair enough. I just tried to gently alert you. The president might have information you don't.
Pillz
Member
Sun Mar 29 14:44:06
Can't trust the government. Not even trump.
Habebe
Member
Sun Mar 29 16:55:46
Wrath, "Let's start with you providing evidence regarding issues with the tests the WHO adopted."

I made no claims. Merely a possibility.

Tell me what Trump has done to warrant such praise? Please tell me of his greatness.


"And yes, a change.org petition - always the best way to judge whether something is credible."

I never cites it as proof, it was mentioned by the Nation of Japan , a pretty credible source imo.

"
As a blanket statement to try to show solidarity and support, I don't have too much issue with it"

So either Trump has handled this greatly OR the WHO is just lying to show solidarity with those it deems important.

Jergul, I am not deeming it a partisan issue. The WHO has.
Habebe
Member
Sun Mar 29 17:08:07
Not to mention the WHO praise of China specifically for " transparency"... After it silenced whistleblowers who could have saved many lives by perhaps keeping it a very localized issue.

They seem.more concerned with solidarity than facts.Perhaps they should become the WSO.
jergul
large member
Sun Mar 29 17:11:56
Habebe
I just think all options should be on the table in the fight against the deep state.

Including, but not limited to walking away from the table and starting anew as an independent State.

It ultimately just represent the culimation of State rights.

The founding fathers never envisioned the shitfest you currently have.

Ask the States of the former USSR. Are they not all greatful for full independence?

Why would it play out differently for you?
Wrath of Orion
Member
Sun Mar 29 17:41:45
Ladies and gentlemen, I give you Retard Rod 2.0.
Habebe
Member
Sun Mar 29 18:29:00
Thats wraths go to line. Congratulations, your a less amusing tc.
Wrath of Orion
Member
Sun Mar 29 18:41:31
Says the person that presented reasons the WHO was not credible, and when called on them, backed out what basically equated to, "I'm not accusing, I'm just asking questions."

lmfao
Wrath of Orion
Member
Sun Mar 29 18:42:03
Wait, wait...I'm not accusing you being a retard, I'm just presenting it as a possibility.
Habebe
Member
Sun Mar 29 19:02:19
Well I will say you are retarded but thats just playing captain obvious.
hood
Member
Sun Mar 29 19:05:01
Your insults are as bad as hot rod too.

Or would you like to just reword what I've said and pretend that you're clever for it?
Habebe
Member
Sun Mar 29 19:12:22
As for the criticisms of the WHO, im not alone.

http://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/4978537002

http://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.economist.com/asia/2020/03/26/let-taiwan-into-the-world-health-organisation

http://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxnews.com/media/who-china-taiwan-interview.amp

http://foreignpolicy.com/2020/02/28/taiwan-who-coronavirus-china-international-organizations/

http://www.google.com/amp/s/time.com/5805629/coronavirus-taiwan/%3famp=true

http://www.aa.com.tr/en/asia-pacific/japan-slams-who-head-over-spread-of-coronavirus/1783336

"Deputy prime minister accuses Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus of being incapable of managing crisis"

http://www.google.com/amp/s/townhall.com/tipsheet/bethbaumann/2020/03/28/australian-reporter-rita-panahi-takes-the-chinese-regime-to-task-over-the-spread-of-the-wuhan-coronavirus-n2565898%3famp=true

Not to mention recent bipartisan support for US Taiwan bill.
The Children
Member
Mon Mar 30 01:43:26
the rugians and habebes cockroaches always live a life of delusion.

they always hamper on these facts as if anyone is doing anything wrong. taiwan, for the last time, nobody recognizes taiwan as a country. its just u idiots that keep hampering on the fact that it is actually an independant region.

noone else will recognize it. its not a country, its not independant. so just like those taiwan morons that constantly use anti china retoriks and threats, they too live a life of delusion. becoz no matter how much racist garbage they use on tv or in politics, nottin will change.

they r like the spoilt delusional teenage kid who stamps his feet on the ground becoz not gettin his spoilt ways and than gettin violent and agressive in his room...

jesus, dude, recognize the fact that ur a worthless 16 year old that nobody respects. tamper tantrum all u want. ur still just a cockroach.


The Children
Member
Mon Mar 30 01:45:34
and why do they need to have politics rammed down there throats when WHO is really just about handlin outbreaks and diseases.

why does they need 2 have politics rammed down there throats by these crazies like rugians and the habebes.

why are these suckers so desperate and wantin that they force everyone into humiliation becoz they dont treat china disrespectfully like the idiots such as rugians and habebes.

why the f should the world treat ur country respectfully, is the bigger question. ur the biggest bully on the planet.
Habebe
Member
Thu Apr 16 16:07:01
Ttt
obaminated
Member
Thu Apr 16 17:20:40
burn them all.
kargen
Member
Thu Apr 16 18:00:07
WHO hasn't been credible for a very very long time. Very little associated with the United Nations is credible. Kind of like how UNICEF lost $150+ million in one year and the explanation was we forgot to do the bookkeeping.
The United Nations and their programs for the most part are just ways for rich people to have a more convenient way to give other peoples money to their friends and families.
Dukhat
Member
Fri Apr 17 03:06:25
"and why do they need to have politics rammed down there throats when WHO is really just about handlin outbreaks and diseases."

TC actually being more cogent than the cuckservatives lol.

To answer, because today's "conservatives" are more about finding "facts" to fit the a conclusion they already believe rather than actually finding a conclusion that fits the facts.

It's the very meaning of idiocy and they embrace it wholeheartedly.
kargen
Member
Fri Apr 17 15:19:59
It isn't so much about politics as it is about WHO doing a piss poor job when it comes to handling outbreaks and diseases.
Paramount
Member
Fri Apr 17 16:06:39
”WHO doing a piss poor job” – Kargen



Between 1990 and 2010, WHO's help has contributed to a 40% decline in the number of deaths from tuberculosis, and since 2005, over 46 million people have been treated and an estimated 7 million lives saved through practices advocated by WHO

Polio is now on the verge of extinction, thanks to a Global Vaccination Drive. the World Health Organization (WHO) stated the eradication programme has saved millions from deadly disease


The WHO has played a leading role in several public health achievements, most notably the eradication of smallpox, the near-eradication of polio, and the development of an Ebola vaccine.
Paramount
Member
Fri Apr 17 16:08:57
Also, I’m not sure it is WHO’s job to ”handle outbreaks and diseases”. In the US it is probably Trump’s and the Republican’s job to handle it.
Wrath of Orion
Member
Fri Apr 17 16:30:59
The issue here is what many people struggle with on this board - it's not black and white. Just because the WHO has issues (and yes it does), doesn't mean it's not credible at all. Just because it has issues with one aspect doesn't necessarily mean those issues extend to other aspects/activities.

I truly wonder how some of you make it through each day in life with though processes like this.
jergul
large member
Fri Apr 17 16:47:06
I think WHO should release its tax returns. It really is the only way we can gauge its credibility.

Perhaps the US court systems can be used as recourse to give us full clarity on the matter?
kargen
Member
Fri Apr 17 17:03:52
"Between 1990 and 2010"

This is 2020.
jergul
large member
Fri Apr 17 17:06:16
Really? The what have you done for me lately argument?

I never took you for a black woman kargen.
Habebe
Member
Fri Apr 17 18:40:07
Paramount, I think you may be giving too much credit to the WHO in those claims. I do realize you said "contributed" though.

Also from 2018 to 2019 polio cases about trippled. From like 30 to 90, so still very low, but it never was a mass killer.
Forwyn
Member
Fri Apr 17 18:44:06
"40% decline in the number of deaths from tuberculosis"

So...distributing an existing vaccine.

Yeah, the WHO seems to be decent at disseminating established, first-world solutions to the third-world.
jergul
large member
Sat Apr 18 02:01:16
Habebe
It was a mass crippler. Which is worse.
Paramount
Member
Mon Apr 20 12:55:20
I should have posted this in this thread and not in the other. So here it is:


WHO says has been 'warning from day one' about virus

The World Health Organization insisted Monday that it had been warning from the very start about the dangers of the novel coronavirus, which has killed more than 164,000 people globally.

"We have been warning from day one that this is a devil that everyone should fight," WHO chief Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus told a virtual briefing in Geneva, after facing scathing criticism from Washington which has accused the agency of initially downplaying the pandemic.

http://afp...m-day-one-about-virus/a/K3m5qy


Looks like WHO has been warning from day one. So it is weird that Trump says they didn’t warn early enough. In fact, wasn’t it Trump who didn’t take the warnings seriously in the beginning? He didn’t care about the warnings, and he said everything was under control. But then when he realized that he fucked up big time because he wasn’t listening, then he panicked, and he is now trying to blame everyone except himself.


” The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA.”
- Trump, Feb 24

”General Motors MUST immediately open their stupidly abandoned Lordstown plant in Ohio, or some other plant, and START MAKING VENTILATORS, NOW!!!!!! FORD, GET GOING ON VENTILATORS, FAST!!!!!! ”
- Trump, Mars 27

Lol. Trump.
Habebe
Member
Mon Apr 20 14:54:23
Jergul, Well worse os debatable.But I dont think it was a mass anything, at its peak it infected half a million people and crippled and killed very few of those.
jergul
large member
Mon Apr 20 17:36:37
" Of the nearly 58,000 cases reported that year, 3,145 died and 21,269 were left with mild to disabling paralysis"

Wiki
Habebe
Member
Mon Apr 20 18:06:52
Jergul, 21k doesn't seem like many at all.
jergul
large member
Mon Apr 20 18:12:05
I hear you. Like the death toll was barely higher than 9/11 and we all know how we shrugged that off with a laugh and a giggle.
hood
Member
Mon Apr 20 19:42:43
21k out of 58k is fucking huge.
Forwyn
Member
Mon Apr 20 20:03:22
24.4k including deaths

42% death or disability is pretty significant
Habebe
Member
Mon Apr 20 20:30:06
At its peak polio killed/disabled 1/2 million a year. That is horrible. That is out of billions of people though and is at its absolute peak.

To put that into perspective the US alone has more deaths from heart disease yearly than the world did polio at its absolute peak.

Ball park 600k/year die from HD innthe US. That's about 30 times the amount that were crippled by polio at its peak.

Is the 21k stat from the US?
jergul
large member
Tue Apr 21 04:48:35
Yes.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Tue Apr 21 05:32:10
Habebe
Now is a good time to go back to the post that started this. Is the WHO doing a piss poor job because the diseases it has helped virtually exterminate "where never mass killers"? Is that the criteria we are working with?
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Tue Apr 21 05:38:19
I understand people love to dabble in Jergulmath we all do, after all the thing that landed us all here in the first place was a game whose core mechanics was Jergulmath. But sometimes, no, often the bigger picture is lost in the minutia of planning how many farms you have to build this turn.
Habebe
Member
Tue Apr 21 06:49:10
Nimatzo, So yes, back tonthe topic....

No im not saying its a bad idea to have a WHO. Nor was the criteria you listed the reason at all.

Now I think they had much less of a role in polio than many give them credit for but that's besides the point.

My point is that I think it needs some revamping, new people and in the wake of this epidemic perhaps make them more effective prevention than they have been.

Also it should be a neutral body politically.I get it though, easier said tham done.
jergul
large member
Tue Apr 21 06:56:07
Why have we even accepted that WHO has done a poor job?

I think it has performed admirably. The weak link is national government responses.

Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Tue Apr 21 07:30:18
"My point is that I think it needs some revamping, new people and in the wake of this epidemic perhaps make them more effective prevention than they have been."

Are you aware that your President was calling Corona "their [democrats] latest hoax" on the 29th of februari? And you think the WHO needs revamping? The WHO does not have any such authority. They are there to spread information, warn, synch the global research and effort. They are not the actual EFFORT, that is up to every country, to contribute with resources, manpower and deploy counter-meassures. Not a whole lot the WHO can do when the leader of the worlds greatest democracy (allegedly) thinks it is a political hoax.
TJ
Member
Tue Apr 21 15:10:29
Nim:

"Are you aware that your President was calling Corona "their [democrats] latest hoax" on the 29th of februari?"

Trump says a lot of crazy stuff, but that is not one of them. You might want to do some fact checking.
hood
Member
Tue Apr 21 17:03:52
He definitely did.

http://www...rump-coronavirus-rally-remark/

Unless someone is going to be purposefully ignorant and suggest that people are saying Trump called the literal virus a hoax, yes, Trump absolutely did what Nim said he did.
TJ
Member
Tue Apr 21 17:07:11
I guess two fact checkers are wrong and fake news then.

http://www...ad-twists-trumps-hoax-comment/

http://www.snopes.com/fact-check/trump-coronavirus-rally-remark/
hood
Member
Tue Apr 21 17:17:23
Your first article says exactly what I said. Your second article is the same exact link I posted that says exactly what I said.

"purposefully ignorant."
TJ
Member
Tue Apr 21 17:31:01
Your link says.

True
During a Feb. 28, 2020, campaign rally in South Carolina, President Donald Trump likened the Democrats' criticism of his administration's response to the new coronavirus outbreak to their efforts to impeach him, saying "this is their new hoax." During the speech he also seemed to downplay the severity of the outbreak, comparing it to the common flu.

What's False
Despite creating some confusion with his remarks, Trump did not call the coronavirus itself a hoax.

He was calling the democratic response to his administrations response a hoax. Not the virus itself. He did downplay the severity of the virus though.

"purposefully ignorant" As you wish. Yes, both links say the same thing.

Hrothgar
Member
Tue Apr 21 17:35:56
I think it's an organization with a good and useful purpose/goal. I also think they absolutely shit the bed as this Pandemic came to light. Pretty much as incompetent as Trump's administration's early response.
hood
Member
Tue Apr 21 17:57:13
It's like you can't understand or refuse to read what I said. Take your pick between retarded or dishonest; you're one of the two.
TJ
Member
Tue Apr 21 18:11:03
I wasn't understanding your original response correctly, that is true and my bad.
Habebe
Member
Tue Apr 21 18:28:29
Nimatzo, Trump never called Coronavirus a hoax.

Your characterization of the WHO shows them to be rather ineffective, whether by design or execution.

Good intentions do not an effective organization make.The league of nations was a great idea.
hood
Member
Tue Apr 21 19:49:13
Fair enough, TJ.


"Nimatzo, Trump never called Coronavirus a hoax."

We just covered this. Trump never called the literal virus a hoax, but he most assuredly called the situation as a whole a hoax.
Habebe
Member
Wed Apr 22 01:54:50
Hood, No. What he said was "is this there new hoax"

Meaning is this the democrats new stunt to attack him.

There claim being he handled this poorly. Whether or not he did or not for now is a seperate issue, im jist clarifying what he said.

To say he called the "whole situation" a hoax is misleading.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Wed Apr 22 02:00:00
I think sort of gets to the point. The man says alot of confusing and stupid things. When he was doing this during the ”trade war” with China his fans were saying it was a mark of his genius 4D chess play. Does anyone think he is trying to game the American public on the pandemic? Well some probably do, but most likely this is what you expect from someone who does not understand that gas can escape his office.

Habebe
You are confusing. Are you advocating for giving more power to global organization to hold authority over nations and force them to do the right things?
Wrath of Orion
Member
Wed Apr 22 08:38:26
Habebe's positions are usually full of contradictions and misunderstandings. This thread is a prime example.
Habebe
Member
Wed Apr 22 10:34:27
Nimatzo, Perhaps, the problem with that however is one of the main criticisms of this current body is that it is a political lackey.

Perhaps for the US we may be better off just taking the funding we spent on the WHO and just creating/ expanding National health organizations.

Im not certain what should be done. But I can say even at what the WHO has done Im not impressed with the service.

1. Tests. It did pass out tests early on. That was good, but very few.

2. Information, for how much funding they get, do they actually have any quality info we couldn't otherwise get?
Habebe
Member
Wed Apr 22 21:38:08
"Australian cybersecurity expert Robert Potter, who confirmed some of the addresses were authentic, also told The Washington Post that the WHO's password system was "appalling" with 48 people having "password" as their password. "


Bwahahahahaha

http://www...rds-dumped-online-2020-4%3famp
Paramount
Member
Mon Apr 27 12:48:35
'World should have listened to WHO' on virus

The World Health Organization's director-general said Monday that the agency had sounded the highest level of alarm over the novel coronavirus early on, but lamented that not all countries had heeded its advice.

Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus pointed out that the WHO warned the COVID-19 outbreak constituted a "Public Health Emergency of International Concern" on January 30, when there were no deaths and only 82 cases registered outside China.

"The world should have listened to WHO then, carefully," he told a virtual press briefing.

The organisation has faced scathing criticism from US President Donald Trump, who earlier this month suspended Washington's funding after accusing WHO of downplaying the seriousness of the outbreak and kowtowing to China, where the novel coronavirus first surfaced late last year.

Trump has provided no evidence to support his claims.

Tedros insisted that the UN health agency had provided sound advice from the beginning "based on the best science and evidence".

But he stressed though that "we do not have any mandate to force countries... to take our advice."

When the WHO announced on January 30 that the novel coronavirus represented "the highest level of emergency... every country could have triggered all its public health measures," Tedros pointed out.

"I think that suffices the importance of listening to WHO's advice."

"We advised the whole world to implement a comprehensive public health approach, and we said find, test, isolate, and do contact tracing," he said.

"You can check for yourselves: countries who followed that are in a better position than others. This is fact."

"It is up to the countries to reject or accept," he said.

"Each country takes its own responsibility."

The pandemic has claimed more than 206,000 lives and infected nearly three million people, according to a tally from official sources compiled by AFP Monday.

The United States has the highest number of deaths at nearly 55,000, out of close to one million registered cases.

http://afp...who-on-virus-director/a/K343wy



” The Coronavirus is very much under control in the USA.”
- Trump, Feb 24

”General Motors MUST immediately open their stupidly abandoned Lordstown plant in Ohio, or some other plant, and START MAKING VENTILATORS, NOW!!!!!! FORD, GET GOING ON VENTILATORS, FAST!!!!!! ”
- Trump, Mars 27


And then Trump blames WHO because of his own ignorance, but WHO has no mandate to force Trump to act.
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