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Utopia Talk / Politics / Crackdown in Hong Kong
Rugian
Member
Mon May 11 08:05:49
MON MAY 11, 2020 / 6:18 AM EDT
Hong Kong police arrest more than 200 as pro-democracy protests return

http://www...-protests-return-idUSKBN22N0QK

I realize that half of this board probably thinks "yOu HaVe No RiGhT tO pRoTeSt DuRiNg A pAnDeMiC" but some of us are still bothered by this sort of news.
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon May 11 08:44:20
"A 22-year-old man was found to have materials believed to be intended for making petrol bombs, police said."


Rugian's regime change bloodthirst is acting up again. Just imagine it is syria, not hong kong, and calm down.
Rugian
Member
Mon May 11 08:46:38
^confirmed for siding against protestors
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon May 11 08:48:31
what are you some bleeding heart retard? Didn't all the bloody interventionism by the US teach you anything?
Rugian
Member
Mon May 11 09:13:47
^thinks that you cant have an opinion on affairs abroad unless you're a nation-building neocon

Go away, Bushite.
Paramount
Member
Mon May 11 09:21:00
Haven’t we gone over this already and showed how the police in the US and elsewhere (France, Chile etc) crackdown harder on protesters than the police in Kong Kong? Do we really need to post all the links again?

Also, in most if not all countries you need a permition to hold a demonstration/protest. If you don’t have permition then the police can arrest you if you refuse to disperse/leave the area. In the US the police might even shoot you. Especially if your skin is brown.
Paramount
Member
Mon May 11 09:26:04
The News: Police crackdown on protesters

Rugian: Some of us are still bothered by this sort of news

Me: Didn’t know you were a Social Justice Warrior
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon May 11 09:26:23
"thinks that you cant have an opinion on affairs abroad unless you're a nation-building neocon"

your 'opinion' is a call for regime change, after all the failures of american imperialism, yeah, I feel like I have to try and straigten your ass up
Rugian
Member
Mon May 11 09:30:07
Who do you think should win the November elections in the US again? Careful, any answer other than Trump constitutes your Canuckistani ass calling for regime change. Straighten your own ass out first, my little untermensch
Rugian
Member
Mon May 11 09:32:01
Paramount

Is your European ass so desperate to appease China that you are willing to throw millions of Hong Kongers under the bus?

You and the EU kowtowing to Beijing is beyond pathetic.
Paramount
Member
Mon May 11 09:32:14
* permition = permission
Paramount
Member
Mon May 11 09:34:59
I want Hong Kong to remain Chinese and not to become a outpost/colony of the US Empire.
Rugian
Member
Mon May 11 09:35:27
The News: China violates One Country Two Systems agreement, cracks down on Hong Kongers seeking to preserve basic human rights

Paramount: I cant care less

The News: EU does anything to try and stop migrants from raping European women

Paramount: HURR DURR HOW DARE THEY REFUGEES DESEVE TO BE TREATED BETTER HURR DURR
Wrath of Orion
Member
Mon May 11 09:37:32
Rugian must be drunk this morning.
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon May 11 09:39:16

" Careful, any answer other than Trump constitutes your Canuckistani ass calling for regime change"

do elaborate, I am team donald, but shouldnt the election be cancelled altogether, to avoid the regime change?

hood
Member
Mon May 11 09:40:12
"I want Hong Kong to remain Chinese and not to become a outpost/colony of the US Empire."

Not to jump to a side here, but this is exceptionally retarded. Hong Kong was a British colony and its successes removed from mainland China are largely a result of that. US interests are (or, were; these days, its a crapshoot) more moral in nature than imperialist.
Rugian
Member
Mon May 11 09:44:11
Oh, I'm sure Xinhua or the People's Daily have been spreading propaganda about how the US wants to turn Hong Kong into an imperial colony. Youd have to be completely braindead to believe such a line, so of course Paramount is totally on board with it.
Paramount
Member
Mon May 11 09:51:23
Hood, yeah I knew it was a British colony. I just want HK to not be another state of the USA.
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon May 11 09:55:31
Rugian: elections with incumbent defeated = regime change

Rugian: I want elections to defeat incumbents.

Rugian: I am against regime change
Rugian
Member
Mon May 11 10:04:03
Crownroyal: If HK and Chinese incumbents are to be defeated, it should be through elections

China: lol we don't have elections

Crownroyal: lol sucks for HK then
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon May 11 10:39:47
I am full of sympathies for all. Once you explain how it is in US interest to promote democracy abroad, you can likely count on my support. I will defend you in these kinds of threads
Rugian
Member
Mon May 11 11:14:16
Why the fuck does it need to be in US interests in order to give support for it? Do you think I'm an agent of the US government or something?
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon May 11 12:14:23
"Why the fuck does it need to be in US interests in order to give support for it?"

To make america great again, duh. But why else would you give support to democracy abroad?
Rugian
Member
Mon May 11 12:23:57
Your premise is inane and idiotic. But if we're going to go that route, I can provide plenty of examples of how Chinese state authoritarian represents a threat to US values at home.
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon May 11 12:32:11
Please do. I already asked you to elaborate. First you need to actually decide if Chinese state authoritarian represents a threat to US values at home, or you support democracy abroad even if it is not in US interest. But in either case, provide 'plenty of examples'
Rugian
Member
Mon May 11 13:54:36
Sure thing. Find me someone who actually wants to debate this point in good faith and I'll be happy to provide them with whatever they reauest.
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon May 11 14:51:32
We do not have to debate anything, if you are not in the mood. I am helping you, you seem all over the place, suddenly concerned with human rights for no good reason, advocating for regime change for no good reason and just shitting on the US interests for no good reason. Now, the Rugian I know is not an swj, he is not concerned with blanket human rights all of a sudden, so you worry me a little
The Children
Member
Tue May 12 04:02:38
lets face it, these sewerrats find any excuse to riot.

so fuck m.

half of them also stopped rioting last december since China cut off foreign finance flow.

two guesses how and who were behind these sewerrats.

fuck these racetraitors.
Dukhat
Member
Tue May 12 04:13:20
The defeated the pandemic so it's ok to protest again.

It's almost as if context and nuance matters.
Habebe
Member
Tue May 12 07:01:41
Paramount, HK will not become a US territory or even a pseudo one. The people of HK do not want to become Chinese(PRC/CCP) they want to be something like Taiwan it seems.China has been crossing the line trying to turn HK into a Chinese city. When the UK let China have HK back in 1997 they did so on the grounds that HK have its freedoms kept intact for atleast 50 years and more Importantly THIS IS WHAT THW HONGKONGERS WANT.

Is ypur hatred of the US so deep that you would rather see a city forcws into gdp rule/slavery?
Habebe
Member
Tue May 12 07:02:01
Forced into CCP rule*
Dakyron
Member
Tue May 12 12:36:52
Britain should reoccupy HK and claim China has reneged on the agreement.

China's tantrum at that would be epic.
The Children
Member
Tue May 12 12:51:13
britain should also retake the new world as claim it as its territory. it was only stolen from it by yanks who kept the lands safe for the brits who in turn are just keepin it safe for the native americans.

as soon as the natives can built a new country, britain would surely give the lands back.

yanks tantrum would be incredible.
Habebe
Member
Tue May 12 12:52:40
Dakyron, I bet the people HK would like that, or ayleast to be in the Commonwealth group.
Habebe
Member
Tue May 12 12:54:13
Tc, The thing is there is no massive outcry by the people for that. Big difference.
Rugian
Member
Sat May 16 15:59:08
Reminder: faced with an opportunity to join in the condemnation of repression in Hong Kong, CR instead chose to side with the leaders of the PRC by offering worthless red herrings and distractions from the debate.

He made his decision, which is fine. He can now live with it.

The Communist Party is a disgusting organization. And for all of the NYT propaganda that CR reads, the rest of the civilized world recognizes their insidious threat to us. Fuck China.
Paramount
Member
Sun May 24 07:47:00
A woman with a sign that reads: ”National security law might kill us”

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-52786734

Hong Kong is like the only one who does not have a national security law. It is actually quite remarkable that there is no national security law in Hong Kong.
Rugian
Member
Sun May 24 07:57:56
"Hong Kong is like the only one who does not have a national security law. It is actually quite remarkable that there is no national security law in Hong Kong."

I'm not exsctly sure how many fallacies you just committed here, but boy is this a doozy.

-Falsely equating lack of something with need of something (HK has no real need for this law for legitimate security purposes)

-Falsely equating lack of something with want of something (the HK people clearly dont want this)

-Falsely implying that all national security systems are more or less equal (when in reality most people would he willing to live under a Western national security regime but not a Chinese one)

Paramount, why are you constantly going to bat for one of the most garbage countries on the planet?
The Children
Member
Sun May 24 08:04:30
first of all, like all others have commented all over da internet already,

a shitload of countries have these same laws. includin good ol usa. patriot act is the same law x 100 steroid doses.

second of all, that woman is a fkin retard. there aint no law killin her. hk is still going to be a GREAT place to live in assumin the sitation returns back to normal aka pre 2019 riots.

otherwise, the city is dead.

she wuld still enjoy her freedoms and shit.
but now she will get charged if she collaberates with white bitches like u rugiot who intend to do spylike thingies.

but thats no different anywhere else in the world, now is it.

The Children
Member
Sun May 24 08:06:30
"c, The thing is there is no massive outcry by the people for that. Big difference."

>> yea there wuldnt.

there wuld just be outright refusal to hand back the lands to the natives.

talk is cheap, bitch. go on and give everything back to the native americans then if ur so great.

yea i thought so...

Paramount
Member
Sun May 24 08:06:52
”Falsely equating lack of something with need of something (HK has no real need for this law for legitimate security purposes) ”

It is not up to you to determine if there is a need for a National Security Law or not.

One can say the same of the US. The US does not need a national security law, nor a Patriot Act. The Americans are also very angry that the government is spying on them and restricting their rights.
Rugian
Member
Sun May 24 08:08:48
"she wuld still enjoy her freedoms and shit."

He says, in response to an article about police cracking down on protestors.
Rugian
Member
Sun May 24 08:11:13
"It is not up to you to determine if there is a need for a National Security Law or not."

Yeah, I'm done responding to you here. "You cant opine on things you dont have control over" is one of the shittiest arguments ever.

See you around, aj4a.
Paramount
Member
Sun May 24 08:11:14
”There is no need for a national security law”

lol, that has got to be one of the dumbest things you have ever said.
Habebe
Member
Sun May 24 08:12:35
And a new wave of protests.

Also the last British governor of HK is making the rounds saying China betrayed HK in there agreement when the UK gifted them.HK
jergul
large member
Sun May 24 08:49:03
What is the problem exactly? The measure is constitutional and China is a Republic, not a democracy.

You guys should recognize the defence. Its the one you use for the US all the time.
Habebe
Member
Sun May 24 09:00:16
Jergul, The issue is that Honkongers want their autonomy and were legally granted it for atleast another 27 years.
jergul
large member
Sun May 24 09:17:06
habebe
They were granted "basic law". Which amounts to their Constitution. The Chinese changes are in keeping with that Constitution.

Constitutional (check)
Republic, not democracy (check)

What are you complaining about exactly?
Habebe
Member
Sun May 24 09:35:36
The same issue that Chris Patten is.
Rugian
Member
Sun May 24 10:35:29
Another asinine response. What is it about the HK issue that causes autocracy lovers to completely lose their ability to make unretarded arguments? Is it because you have no actual leg to stand on here?

Being a republic is not a license to engage in unlimited tyranny against the citizenry. The mental gymnastics required to even make that argument are astounding.
CrownRoyal
Member
Sun May 24 11:09:15
I don't know, Rugian's soaring rhetoric almost convinces me, fuck these tyrants. Now do syria, or egypt, so nobody can blame you for being against tyranny only when it suits you
jergul
large member
Sun May 24 11:25:47
Ruggy
It is your unappologetic attitude to many things I dislike that has me curious as to why you want me to dislike this particular thing, but not others.

We can review it again in November if it turns out that Trump wins the election without winning the popular vote.

You can explain to me how that is how your constitution is set up and how the US is a republic and not a democracy.

I am sure it will make better sense to me then.
The Children
Member
Sun May 24 12:09:53
lmao these fuckin idiots thinks autonomy (the ability to govern basic and daily shit) equals state subversion?

no no no rugiot. HK will remain autonomous for at least 27 years.

autonomy aint gonna end. whats gonna end is american influence. we allowed u have ur spy hub there. we allowed u in for food and shit. we gave u hospitality.

no no no, u abused it. u made fun of us. u humiliated us. took our hospitality for granted.

so, bye bye.

Habebe
Member
Sun May 24 12:42:17
Tc, By we you mean the UK?
Habebe
Member
Sun May 24 15:47:05
You know whats funny? The US is actually legally obligated to sanction China over this HK stunt.
jergul
large member
Mon May 25 06:58:03
Habebe
Thats like saying Germany was legally obligated to invade Poland.
Habebe
Member
Mon May 25 07:22:59
Jergul, Trump and Pelosi pushed a bill last year.

The Hong Kong Human Rights and Democracy Act of 2019 (HKHRDA)[1] (S. 1838; Pub.L. 116–76) is a United States federal law that requires the U.S. government to impose sanctions against China and Hong Kong officials responsible for human rights abuses in Hong Kong, and requires the United States Department of State and other agencies to conduct an annual review to determine whether changes in Hong Kong's political status (its relationship with mainland China) justify changing the unique, favorable trade relations between the U.S. and Hong Kong.[2][3][4][5] The passage of the bill was supported by pro-democracy activists in Hong Kong,[2] and in 2019 received near-unanimous support in Congress.[6]

http://en....Human_Rights_and_Democracy_Act
jergul
large member
Mon May 25 07:59:14
Habebe
I know. Hitler was legally obligated to invade Poland as soon as he signed the exectutive order (authorised under the emergency powers act) to invade poland.

Nothing anyone could do. The invasion was a legal obligation.
Habebe
Member
Mon May 25 08:37:09
Well you know. Ancy Pelosi, Trump, Hitler they are all the same right?

So the US take a non violent stand in defense of human rights and democratic/ Republican values and they are called Hitler.

But if we didn't, we would.be called selfish isolationist.

Tbh, I think the UK should be taking more of a stand considering the history.
jergul
large member
Mon May 25 09:34:53
Habebe
The US makes a law, then says the US is obliged to follow a law it made.

Well sure. But anyone can make laws they are obliged for follow.

For example China. It is making a law that it will be obliged to follow in Hong Kong.

So what is your problem exactly?

jergul
large member
Mon May 25 09:46:42
http://alfred.stlouisfed.org/series?seid=GDPNOW

You better hurry if you want to smite China with the full force of your mighty service sector.

Or too long, did not read. Covid-19.
Habebe
Member
Mon May 25 09:54:57
Jergul, well, duh. Thats sort of how it works. How many nations follow laws that they did not enact?

Basically it started with HK receiving preferred treatment because of its greater amount of freedom.

My " problem" was that you then compared the US to Hitler for applying non violent actions in defense of dem/rep values.

But when the US " doesn't take leadership" you deem them isolationist.
jergul
large member
Mon May 25 10:06:40
"Obligated" infers some form of international thing. Like how we were obligated to help out in Afghanistan because you invoked a multilateral treaty.

That you have a law that will save Trump from having to flourish his felt pen and sign an executive order makes no difference beyond the felt ink it saves.
jergul
large member
Mon May 25 10:09:11
You are not taking leadership. You are doing stuff to try and re-elect Trump.

The law itself is mostly the conscequence of a trade war that is seeing 1 country, two systems economic divergence.

There is no way in hell China is going to let HKs economy outpace its national growth.

Thankfully, the US has a law on the books that will force it to slap down Hong Kongs economy.
Habebe
Member
Mon May 25 10:19:31
"You are not taking leadership. You are doing stuff to try and re-elect Trump"

You realize Nancy Pelosi was ome of the biggest proponets of this bill, right?
jergul
large member
Mon May 25 10:47:22
Habebe
You do know that Pelosi is one of the greatest political strategists the US has ever seen?

She has been undermining Trump's message that he is at war with someone or something and the Democrats are surrender monkeys before Trump even began to be at war with someone or something.
CrownRoyal
Member
Mon May 25 12:04:46
US could offer green card to every HK resident, to save them from tyranny. If things get super bad, I mean.
Habebe
Member
Mon May 25 12:23:12
Actually, I wouldn't mind increasing HK immigrants by making immigration easier.
jergul
large member
Mon May 25 12:52:12
You could like double the current 4000 a year to like...8000 per year!
swordtail
Anarchist Prime
Mon May 25 12:56:00
http://twitter.com/CarlZha/status/1264725177868288000
swordtail
Anarchist Prime
Mon May 25 13:19:50
http://twitter.com/F3Ptu/status/1264481781505556480
swordtail
Anarchist Prime
Mon May 25 13:20:22
http://twitter.com/timdayipper/status/1264487148608057344
jergul
large member
Mon May 25 13:31:05
Habebe
See anything there worthy of arrests? Or would that be against freedom?
Habebe
Member
Mon May 25 13:56:20
" those who need more evidence: this is how #HongKong rioters terrorize police. HK is softest police I ever saw anywhere. Rioters beat, humiliate. Then twist events. Lie, lie, lie! Western media fully complicit. All of us who work, document Hong Kong have images like these!"


Hahahaha

Oh those poor armed storm troopers being attacked by those horrible youths.
Habebe
Member
Mon May 25 13:56:20
" those who need more evidence: this is how #HongKong rioters terrorize police. HK is softest police I ever saw anywhere. Rioters beat, humiliate. Then twist events. Lie, lie, lie! Western media fully complicit. All of us who work, document Hong Kong have images like these!"


Hahahaha

Oh those poor armed storm troopers being attacked by those horrible youths.
Habebe
Member
Mon May 25 13:57:07
The guy sounds like tc
Habebe
Member
Tue May 26 10:28:18
" those who need more evidence: this is how #Warsaw Ghetto. rioters terrorize Nazi soldiers. Warsaw is softest SS I ever saw anywhere. Rioters beat, humiliate. Then twist events. Lie, lie, lie! Jewish media fully complicit. All of us who work, document Warsaw have images like these!"
Paramount
Member
Thu May 28 12:56:45
China adopts decision to make Hong Kong national security laws

-- "National security is like the air. Without it, no one can survive," said Witman Hung, a national lawmaker from Hong Kong.

-- For the next step, the National People's Congress will entrust its standing committee to make national security laws to be promulgated and enforced in Hong Kong.

-- "One country, two systems" will not be changed.

By Xinhua writers Xu Lingui, Zhang Bowen, Fang Dong, Li Zhihui

BEIJING, May 28 (Xinhua) -- China is set to make Hong Kong national security laws as a related decision was adopted at the national legislature on Thursday.

The decision will also allow the central government's national security organs to set up agencies in Hong Kong when needed.

Deputies to the 13th National People's Congress (NPC) voted overwhelmingly to approve the decision at the closing meeting of the NPC annual session.

Rounds of applause erupted in the Great Hall of the People when the decision was passed.

The NPC Decision on Establishing and Improving the Legal System and Enforcement Mechanisms for the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region (HKSAR) to Safeguard National Security consists of an introduction and seven articles.

The decision was made to safeguard national sovereignty, security and development interests, uphold and improve "one country, two systems," safeguard Hong Kong's long-term prosperity and stability, and guarantee the legitimate rights and interests of Hong Kong residents, says the introduction.

Li Zhanshu, chairman of the NPC Standing Committee, said the decision "serves the fundamental interests of all Chinese people including Hong Kong compatriots."

For the next step, the NPC will entrust its standing committee to make national security laws to be promulgated and enforced in Hong Kong.

HKSAR Chief Executive Carrie Lam welcomed the move and said the HKSAR government will fully cooperate with the NPC Standing Committee to complete relevant legislation as soon as possible.

On Thursday, Lam took part in a public campaign in Hong Kong to support the national security legislation. In less than five days, more than 1.85 million Hong Kong residents have signed a petition supporting the legislation.

"NATIONAL SECURITY IS LIKE THE AIR"

The legislative move came after prolonged social unrest and escalating street violence had plunged Hong Kong into the gravest situation since its return to the motherland in 1997.

Hong Kong had witnessed rampant activities of "Hong Kong independence" organizations and violent radicals as well as blatant interference by external forces.

Presenting the draft to the national legislature last week, senior legislator Wang Chen said increasingly notable national security risks in Hong Kong have become a prominent problem.

There are apparent "weak links" in Hong Kong's existing legal system and enforcement mechanisms in safeguarding national security, said Wang, vice chairman of the NPC Standing Committee.

Considering Hong Kong's situation at present, efforts must be made at the state level to establish and improve the legal system and enforcement mechanisms for the HKSAR to safeguard national security, he said.

"National security is like the air. Without it, no one can survive," said Witman Hung, an NPC deputy from the HKSAR. "The NPC decision comes at the right time."

PURVIEW OF CENTRAL AUTHORITIES

Alan Hoo, chairman of the Basic Law Institute in Hong Kong, said national security legislation is a state legislative power no matter a country adopts the unitary or federal system. National security laws can be found in both common law and continental law systems.

Hong Kong, he said, cannot remain unguarded.

In an online article on the issue, Secretary for Justice Teresa Cheng of the HKSAR government said national security is a matter of national interest that concerns the whole population of China and falls squarely within the purview of the central authorities.

Cheng stressed that it is fundamental to recognize that the central authorities hold the ultimate responsibility for national security in all local administrative regions.

TINY NUMBER OF "TROUBLEMAKERS" TARGETED

The decision says the country will prevent, stop and punish acts and activities endangering national security. The country will also resolutely oppose the interference in Hong Kong affairs by any foreign or external forces in any form and will take necessary countermeasures, it adds.

Tam Yiu-chung, a member of the NPC Standing Committee, said the legislation does not target the ordinary Hong Kong residents but "a tiny number" of people suspected of endangering national security.

Illegal activities particularly mentioned include splitting the country, subverting state power, organizing and carrying out terrorist activities, as well as interfering in Hong Kong affairs by foreign and external forces.

The law-based freedom of speech, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly enjoyed by Hong Kong residents will not be disturbed, their daily lives will not be affected, and the security of their property will continue to be protected, Tam said.

"ONE COUNTRY, TWO SYSTEMS" NOT CHANGED

Under "one country, two systems," Hong Kong, as a special administrative region of China, has a high degree of autonomy and retains its own capitalist system and lifestyle.

Speaking to the press after the legislative session, Chinese Premier Li Keqiang said "one country, two systems" is China's basic state policy, and the decision is designed for the policy's steady implementation.

Chief Executive of the Hong Kong Monetary Authority Eddie Yue said the legislation will not bring any change to the fundamentals of Hong Kong's monetary and financial system.

The free flow of capital and free convertibility of the Hong Kong dollar will continue to be safeguarded by the Basic Law of the HKSAR, Yue said.

Neither will the legislation change Hong Kong's legal system.

"Under the Basic Law, judicial independence is guaranteed, and this will continue as before," said Grenville Cross, former director of public prosecutions of Hong Kong.

http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-05/29/c_139096712.htm
Habebe
Member
Thu May 28 13:07:44
Maintaining order within HK is the duty of HK, not Beijing.
Paramount
Member
Thu May 28 13:08:45
How foreign people in Hong Kong think of national security legislation

The foreign interviewees said the national security legislation is absolutely necessary, and no country would tolerate subversive, secessionist, terrorist activities on its soil.


PEOPLE UNEASY AMID VIOLENCE

"People were uneasy," Robinson, a Hong Kong resident of British origin, said when describing life under the shadow of violence last year in Hong Kong.

Having lived in Hong Kong for over 10 years, he witnessed how the prosperous and safe financial hub was plunged into chaos during social unrest. "The disruption from June (2019) last year did affect life and work. Schools were closed, events canceled and transport disrupted."

Hong Kong's stability is essential to international trade, Robinson said.




During months of disturbances following the now-withdrawn ordinance amendments concerning fugitive transfers, processions, hijacked by rioters who claimed to be "freedom fighters," repeatedly descended into violent incidents, which threatened the safety and freedoms of residents and eroded Hong Kong's economic foundation and rule of law.

Dan Albertson, a freelancer from the United States, was deeply concerned.

"The level of violence in Hong Kong makes me and many other people concerned," Albertson said.




In 2019, Albertson, 35, left Chicago where he had lived for 10 years to start a new life in Hong Kong. He looked forward to a fresh experience but was shocked by violent protests and destructive activities erupting all of a sudden and keeping intensifying in Hong Kong.

"They are the people who talk about laws and freedom while simultaneously eroding the freedoms of other people who don't agree with them," he said. "You cannot beat up people for disagreeing with you."




Ever since last June, fanatics have used violence of all types to wage war on the society and there has been a surge in home-grown terrorist activities, which is designed to destabilize the country as a whole, Grenville Cross, former director of public prosecutions of Hong Kong, said.


LEGISLATION LONG "OVERDUE"

Grenville Cross believes the violence in Hong Kong has been condoned and encouraged by foreign powers. "They see Hong Kong as a useful means of destabilizing China at a time of geopolitical rivalry, and Hong Kong is just a pawn on their chessboard for them."

Cross said foreign powers have encouraged their local proxies in the protest movement to stoke up trouble.

"The independence fanatics are clearly pandering to their American backers, who have never really accepted Hong Kong's return to China and see Hong Kong as part of their sphere of influence," Cross said.

Cross stressed that no country would tolerate subversive, secessionist, terrorist activities on its soil, and the legislation is absolutely necessary.

"The national security legislation is overdue in Hong Kong," Robinson said, echoing Cross's words.

"The legislation is the right thing to do because Hong Kong is part of the Chinese territory," Albertson said. "The Chinese authorities have all their legal responsibility to protect their territory. That's the same of any country."





NOTHING TO FEAR

"The broad mass of people ... have nothing to fear," Grenville Cross said, stressing that only a small group of people will be targeted and law-abiding residents are outside the ambit. Cross, a British barrister, had worked as the director of public prosecutions in Hong Kong for 12 years since 1997.

The National People's Congress has made it clear that the legislation only targets those engaged in acts and activities to split the country, subvert state power, organize and carry out terrorist activities and other behaviors that seriously endanger national security, as well as activities of foreign and external forces to interfere in the affairs of the HKSAR.

The basic rights and freedoms of Hong Kong people will continue to be protected under the Basic Law and the judicial independence will also be guaranteed, Cross said.

Dan Albertson, who has traveled multiple times to the Chinese mainland, said Hong Kong is a bridge between the mainland and the West and he believes the unique advantage, along with the rights and freedoms of Hong Kong people, will continue to be cherished.

There is no logic to be afraid of the legislation, Albertson said. "I suppose a lot of the people who are concerned have never been to the mainland or they only hear about mainland news filtered by biased and unreliable media outlets."

Cross pointed out that the business environment will also improve after the legislation.

"The last thing the business community wants is a continuation of the violent protests of last year, which has resulted in so many businesses closing down or moving elsewhere, and tourists staying away," Cross said.

"If the national security legislation helps to control the illegal and violent activities bringing death and destruction to Hong Kong, I imagine that all foreign businesses will feel very relieved."

http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-05/28/c_139096554.htm
Habebe
Member
Thu May 28 13:17:01
"he National People's Congress has made it clear that the legislation only targets those engaged in acts and activities to split the country, subvert state power, organize and carry out terrorist activities and other behaviors that seriously endanger national security, as well as activities of foreign and external forces to interfere in the affairs of the HKSAR."

1. If the people of HK truly wanted this wouldn't they habe enacted such laws, as is there right granted to them for another 27 years.

2. Who decides what is considered subversive acts? Beijing? Considering there track record and the fact that They are accountable to no one, thats probably not desired by hongkongers.
The Children
Member
Thu May 28 13:33:00
sheepbebe shuddup. it is beijings duty to safeguard HK.

and foreign as well as HK peoples all agree. this law is necessary!

and should have come sooner!
Habebe
Member
Thu May 28 13:55:47
Not according to the British. Who when they gifted there city to the PRC made the chinks agree that HK has the right to maintain peace and protest as they wish.
jergul
large member
Thu May 28 14:47:30
Habebe
The lease expired. The new law is introduced fully in accordance with HKs basic law (which was what China agreed HK should have).
Habebe
Member
Thu May 28 15:21:30
(11) The maintenance of public order in the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region will be the responsibility of the Government of the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region.

Even Chris Patten who was the governor at the time of the deal and was party to the deal says this goes against the agreement.
The Children
Member
Thu May 28 15:23:07
"Not according to the British. "

>> "People were uneasy," Robinson, a Hong Kong resident of British origin, said when describing life under the shadow of violence last year in Hong Kong."

>> rofl does ur brain even function at all.

Habebe
Member
Thu May 28 15:23:30
http://www.cmab.gov.hk/mobile/en/issues/jd2.htm

Here is a link to the actual agreement.
Habebe
Member
Thu May 28 15:26:44
http://www...a-betrayal-of-hong-kong-people

“The British government should make it clear that what we are seeing is a complete destruction of the joint declaration.”
The Children
Member
Thu May 28 15:30:26
who gives a Fuck about the joint declaration by now.

u ruined the city last year and u had the city being destroyed and the peoples humiliated.

And u think we gonna give 2 shits about ur declaration now.

sheepbebe go get ur brain checked.
jergul
large member
Thu May 28 15:30:58
Article 23
The Hong Kong Special Administrative Region shall enact laws on its own to prohibit any act of treason, secession, sedition, subversion against the Central People's Government, or theft of state secrets, to prohibit foreign political organizations or bodies from conducting political activities in the Region, and to prohibit political organizations or bodies of the Region from establishing ties with foreign political organizations or bodies.
The Children
Member
Thu May 28 15:32:54
wheres camaroo wheres his big mouth now.

he was talkin so tough last year.
where he at now. cat got his tongue.

Habebe
Member
Thu May 28 15:36:42
Jergul, The hksar, not Beijing.

Your proving my point.
The Children
Member
Thu May 28 15:44:27
bottomline sheepbebe, HK is an undeniable part of china.

u shuld not daydream about any other option, sheep.

jergul
large member
Thu May 28 15:48:53
Habebe
So, as long as it is HK that actually introduces the laws in its legislature, your point is gone?
Habebe
Member
Thu May 28 15:52:14
So long as the people of HK genuinely want and through there autonomous government enact the law, yes.

Not some commie loophole to circumvent HK as a free city.
The Children
Member
Thu May 28 16:07:07
ur god damned right, kid.

and they want.
dunt u worry about that. noone supports u anymore.

Paramount
Member
Sat May 30 14:19:07
Why Hong Kong needs a National Security Law

http://twitter.com/ml_1maria/status/1198577873067614210?s=21
Paramount
Member
Sun May 31 15:52:39
USA gives up and abandons Hong Kong! It will be the China-way! China has won!


Department of State
@StateDept @SecPompeo
President Trump has asked us to review every preferential treatment that Hong Kong had and work to eliminate it. If the Chinese are going to treat Hong Kong the same way that they treat the mainland, there is no basis for the U.S. to treat it differently as well

http://twitter.com/statedept/status/1267193063824293889?s=21
Paramount
Member
Thu Jun 04 14:07:43
Hong Kong: Tens of thousands defy ban to attend Tiananmen vigil

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-52920083


^ Look. They are not being beaten by rabid cops, not being shot at, no teargassing, no pepperspraying, no police cars are running over them, no national guard harrassing them or shooting at journalists. They have more freedom than USA.
The Children
Member
Thu Jun 04 15:44:11
cucknews bbc is fake.

theres about a 1000 people gathered.

down 90% from the last 20 years.

also tianmen is a color revolution. we been hearin fake propaganda since 1990...

nottin happeneed 2 tankman and theres 100 thousands protests every day around the world but somehow white fakenews propaganda likes 2 remind us about this one every year.

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