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Utopia Talk / Politics / Holy shit this place is still here
Aeros
Member
Tue Aug 31 16:32:41
How are you all doing? I see Hot Rod finally and for real died. RIP.
murder
Member
Tue Aug 31 16:45:47

Barely. I think this place is down to a handful of posts per day now. I'd like to think that covid got most of us. ;o)

Paramount
Member
Tue Aug 31 16:49:33
We thought that you had died.
Habebe
Member
Tue Aug 31 16:50:41
Aeros, It was a coin toss if you were still alive.Apparently you left with some health issues going on.Glad to see your alive and well.


I left for a while, but "Every time I try to leave, it pulls me back in"
Aeros
Member
Tue Aug 31 16:57:22
Eh, the health issues were secondary. It was actually more some self reflection. While I was here I was very much opposed to the libertarian, right wing political spectrum. Some things in my personal life and my own creeping realization of things led to some cognitive dissonance. I've spent the last few years working it out. The Red Pill sucks.

Region was right all along God help me
Paramount
Member
Tue Aug 31 17:07:14
Did you participate in the revolution that took place on january 6?
Aeros
Member
Tue Aug 31 17:17:49
Nope. It was traded Boomer shenanigans from start to finish. Seeing the split in how our government decided to deal with it however finally flipped my politics. The establishment was quite happy with Burn Loot Murder over 2020 and never raised a finger to deal with it and called it a peaceful protest. But a bunch of boomers wandering through the capital with some spastics in viking hats was the greatest threat to our democracy since the war of 1812.
patom
Member
Tue Aug 31 17:31:11
Hey, you still in Virginia?
nhill
Member
Tue Aug 31 17:38:44
Glad to see you didn’t shit the bed. What was the result of your health issues?
Dukhat
Member
Tue Aug 31 17:58:17
Aeros falling to the same dumb shit most white guys fall too is not surprising. Though I suspect it's more likely this is just someone aping his account.
Aeros
Member
Tue Aug 31 18:10:23
They finally found a drug that works. It requires a monthly injection but I am healthy with it. Still in Virginia. As for "falling for the same dumb shit", I actually had a front row seat to the riots last year. Watching a bunch of out of town trust fund white kids run interference for hood rats looting the local businesses and calling it justice pretty much put the nail in the coffin of my support for the democrats. Seeing the local businesses put signs with BLM and the red communist salute ( Closed up raised fist) I just watched senior American Generals talk about how they were relying on the fucking Taliban. We have all been here since 2001. Why the fuck is the Taliban dictating policy to us?
Rugian
Member
Tue Aug 31 18:22:01
Jesus Christ, we all thought you were dead. Glad to see that your PTSD and rotting asshole haven't brought you down.

And welcome to life after taking the red pill! Since you're in VA, you paying any attention to the whole Loudoun clusterfuck?
Dukhat
Member
Tue Aug 31 18:23:29
Hood Rats looting businesses was not supported by anyone. The rich white kids would never be found anywhere near those hood rats anyways. Undoubtedly looting happened and was dealt with more or less while most protests were peaceful.

Trump negotiated the deal with the Taliban without consulting the Afghan national government and forced them to release thousands of prisoners along with many of the leaders that ended up launching the recent counteroffensive. Biden just continued it. The quid pro quo is that the Taliban leaves Americans alone and we just leave Afghanistan. It's the best hand Biden could play after Trump drew down troop numbers and support to basically 0. And you blame Democrats for this?

Did you become some kind of idiot that overvalues anecdotes over facts? Sounds to me like you were just bombarded with misinformation by your network and got sucked into the hole of stupid.

If you are even really Aeros. He was more cogent. And he would barely care about this shit if he had a daughter and wife to take care of like most of us in the real world when we see some fucking retarded right-wing propaganda.
Aeros
Member
Tue Aug 31 19:26:26
I used to live pretty close to Loudon so that hit close to home. Pretty disgraceful.


As for being cogent, it's hard to do on a phone but for my grand return I may as well respond to Dukhat and explain my thought process.

If I am controlling for Bias I figure I should go back to the start, when I told Rugian I would happily be the boot on his neck. At this time I was still in the military and on track for a cushy government job after I finished my education at University. Instead what ended up happening was the Obama sequestration and me being thrown out on my ass. My medical issues prevented reinlistment and the civilian sector was not hiring.

Candidly, this could be seen as the point where my beliefs flipped but really that is not the case. What this did was kick me out of the system and allowed me to view it from the outside. The final years of Obama were an absolute debacle. From Syrian Red Lines, to Libya and the subsequent European migrant crisis. Then came the 2016 election. I voted for Gary Johnson. But the true red pill was watching the CNN melt down when Trump won.

You see, before this point I was a RELIGOUS CNN watcher and before the election they were all Trump, all the time. Especially during the Primaries. Fox News was more skeptical of Trump then CNN. CNN did live coverage of every Trump rally. They even had count downs to them. But when Trump won, suddenly this was a catastrophe. A 180 degree flip. Which to me was odd because up to that point CNN was all for Trump being the Republican nominee.

This is what broke me out of what I now believe is a deliberate cognitive cage. A system of control that modern news media is an integral part of. I went quiet here because I could no longer reconcile this realization with my past opinions and at the same time was forced to reconcile with my role in supporting a system of control I was increasingly convinced existed solely to perpetuate and the power of an unelected oligarchy and beaurocracy. Keep in mind I came very close to joining that beaurocracies ranks so I had familiarity with the way the people within it thought and acted.

And it just got worse from there. For example Charlottesville. Seeing what Terry Mcauliff pulled off there was eye raising. I watched the live streams and I watched the Virginia State Police clear the park by pushing the right wing crowd into the left wingers. With absolutely predictable results. And not ONE member of the media raised their hands and asked thd Virginia governor why the VSP did that. There was only the endless hand wringing about the ensuing violence and not one look at how the violence resulted on the direct orders of the Governor. A governor who incidentally is a member of the Clinton machine.

After that came 2020, and seeing what happened to Virginia's capital was so depressing. The downtown core once so vibrant is deserted again like it's the 1990s again. Every business has a BLM sign in their windows like it's the fucking blood of the lamb on the door panels to deter the angel of death. I watched political terrorism work. Keep in mind I have first hand experience with it. What BLM did to Richmond VA was no different then what AL Qaeda in Iraq did to the villages my unit was responsible for. The only difference is BLM apparently had US government support and their terrorism worked. Thr fact that COVIS does not spread in BLM protests but most definitely does at Trump rallies was the cherry on top.

And that was when I realized I could not go back. Even if I was offered a job in the government tomorrow I would not get a security clearance because I just would not be able to lie on the "opinion questions". None of this brings me any particular happiness mind you. Tbqh it's pretty depressing to realize everything you previously believed was a lie. There is no euphoria of "conversion" here. This shit sucks.

But I've always rather arrogantly assumed I am fairly intelligent and free thinking. Part of that is to admit when you are wrong. Even if in the admitting you are forced to shatter your entire previous conception of reality.
murder
Member
Tue Aug 31 20:09:26

"Why the fuck is the Taliban dictating policy to us?"

Because we didn't kill them. Apparently we don't kill anyone anymore except with the occasional drone strike, and then only with a warrant and only if the terrorist provides 3 forms of ID.

We've taken the explosives out of hellfire missiles. I don't know what else to say.

Dukhat
Member
Tue Aug 31 20:11:09
So you were unemployed and radicalized. Sequestration was forced on Obama by the Republicans so to blame him for it is a fucking joke. As for Syria, he kept us mostly out and supported our allies in the area. Meanwhile Trump abandoned our allies.

You just need a job and to stop spending time watch cable news or being online. Cnn does suck dick. Stop generalizing over it. You saw some talking heads lose their cool who gives a fuck. And Trump did turn out to be a fucking disaster. So all the liberuls were right. See the idiotic covid response that is ongoing today.

I dont know why you get triggered by BLM unless you are constantly bombarded by right wing white victimization propaganda. If you see a sign, who gives a fuck. Some people use the marches as an excuse to loot. Doesn’t mean they did ‘t have any meaning. All that other stuff is pretty fucking subjective. Even if the governor somehow pushed the groups together, it’s always the right-wingers that end up killing people.

And your use of the word red-pilling is so 2016. Its used by an embarassing group of white male teenagers to describe their descent into helpless chauvinism.

Go retrain and use your veterans benefits and stop wasting time getting triggered. Your daughter deserves better.
Aeros
Member
Tue Aug 31 20:41:23
Actually I don't have regular internet or TV anymore. Never been happier. And I am most assuredly not unemployed.
CrownRoyal
Member
Tue Aug 31 21:23:43
How's the asshole, Aeros? Good to see you well, btw
Pillz
Member
Tue Aug 31 21:59:35
Aeros comes back to UP and the first thing he does is respond to cuckhat.

Might as well fuck off if you have nothing of value to post.
Forwyn
Member
Wed Sep 01 00:04:54
Glad to see you're alive and doing well, bud. I may have drunkenly Googled "Aeros" over the past couple years to check for any hits on other forums.

Don't worry about Cuckhat; his ascent to billionaire status made it hard for him to converse with the peons in a reasonable fashion. lulz

http://www...hread=85343&time=1627558277741
Cloud Strife
Member
Wed Sep 01 04:14:27
I'm glad the asshole's held up. It's something I've wondered daily over the last several years.
Dukhat
Member
Wed Sep 01 08:50:18
Aeros just became a retard is all. Your relationships trump reason. All this whining about BLM and nothing about how Trump tear gassed peaceful protesters for a cheap photo op. Blaming the police for pushing people together and assuming it's some psyops by the Democratic governor instead of just policemen being dumb and then ignoring the fact that it's the right that's always the one killing people.

He's in the echo chamber. I'm surprised he didn't try to shill crypto just like Nhil.
Dukhat
Member
Wed Sep 01 08:51:34
Forwyn thinks he's reasonable. The number of relationships he has with women is basically just his wife. The one time I tried to engage in a cited discussion, everything he sourced was still far-right trash. Less stupid about aping far-right talking points like Rugian but still stupid.
Paramount
Member
Wed Sep 01 09:18:53
” Why the fuck is the Taliban dictating policy to us?”

It was part of the deal that Trump made when he surrendered to the Taliban. According to the surrender agreement, you are now supposed to finance and help the new Islamic regime in Afghanistan, and you are not allowed to threat them (unless they threat you). But you are basically their bitch now. lol
Dukhat
Member
Wed Sep 01 09:26:39
Aeros blaming Democrats for problems Republicans caused. And he fell for it because probably all his close relationships are with Republicans blaring mistruths. Obama was to blame for all the shit the Dubya and Reagonomics caused. Now Biden is to blame for all the shit Trump caused.

The Republican strategy of placing ticking time bombs for future generations (democrats) to solve continues unabated.
Sam Adams
Member
Wed Sep 01 10:12:21
"Hood Rats looting businesses was not supported by anyone."

Except, you know, half the democrat party.
Paramount
Member
Wed Sep 01 10:14:38
”the health issues were secondary

I don't have regular internet or TV anymore.”



The only thing that can stop any of us from going to this forum and post is either if you are dead or in jail. I don’t believe that you can take a several years long break from this forum. With BLM, Trump, the insurrection, covid, and everything – you would have posted here if you were able to.

So correct me if I’m wrong but I’m guessing that your absence from this forum since 2018(?) is because you have been in jail. The health issue with your ass was just imaginary – it was psychological. You were worried that your ass would get hurt in jail.

But now you are out of jail and it wasn’t so dangerous that you thought. Your ass is actually okay, so you are now downplaying the ”health issue”? And the reason why you don’t have internet and tv yet is because you canceled it prior to going to jail. Why else would someone cancel internet? The internet is a prerequisite for living a life today.
Sam Adams
Member
Wed Sep 01 10:16:36
Also welcome back aeros!
nhill
Member
Wed Sep 01 10:32:37
"He's in the echo chamber. I'm surprised he didn't try to shill crypto just like Nhil."

Trading Performance June 29th-Aug 30th:

BTC: +36.7%
nhill: +75.5%
S&P 500: +5.6%

Suck it, biatch. I could have turned your 1 billion (lmao) into 1.75 billion within 3 months.

Although my best investment is truly the real estate in your head.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Wed Sep 01 12:15:31
Glad to see you Aeros, alive and everything :,)
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Wed Sep 01 12:42:17
Aeros

Dukhat as it turns out, is a total piece of shit and garbage human being. Here is a glance into his head:

http://uto...hread=85578&time=1629906211746

I respect your honesty about the product of your introspection and I always respected your ability to wear it all on your sleeves. I always saw some intrinsic part of myself in you, still do.

I really missed you man.
Dukhat
Member
Wed Sep 01 12:46:16
I did some harmless trolling. Not like I killed hundreds of thousands of Americans with ineptitude or tried to draw people into a cryptocurrency bubble like some assholes on here.

The irony of Rugian fishing for sympathy while pushing for an ideology that puts himself and his small in-group first above all else, including the truth, is lost on Nim.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Wed Sep 01 12:59:15
Probably in your demented world, grieving the loss of your father on the forum, is fishing for sympathy. And your (literally what you wrote) "raw naked hatred" was harmless trolling.

You broke a convention that only revealed something about you, if there ever is a valid point you have about Rugian and his "ideology" it is drowned out by that sociopath meltdown you had. You know what, I am going to think higher of you and say that you know these things. You know that you broke a convention that even the criminal scumbags abide by and you have had a hard time reconciling this.

Be a man about it.
Aeros
Member
Wed Sep 01 13:22:06
Eh, I was honestly just bored of arguing on the internet and had a bunch of IRL shit that had my attention. Not in jail, quite the opposite. Been busy building my life. Some bets on Crypto paid off handsomely and I bought the proverbial 3 bedroom, white picket fence and dog. I checked back in here on a whim tbqh. And yes, the asshole is still broken. It actually got worse as my immune system decided it was time to just try and kill me outright and attacked every joint in my body, including the ball socket where my spine attaches to the skull. Picture grandpa's arthritis, only designed and implemented by Satan. That was another week in the hospital. Thankfully they've got me on something that works wonderfully. The arthritis attack was actually a big tell that the gut issues may have been something else and the change of medicine has pretty much stopped all my symptoms.
Dukhat
Member
Wed Sep 01 13:24:31
What convention are you enforcing asshole? Decency doesn’t exist on this forum. Brazenly Racist and Misogynistic things are said all the time but because they’ve become internalized as just a part of male internet culture you overlook it. You draw a line at a person’s dead dad. That’s fine, but that’s your personal choice not mine or anyone else’s on here. You don’t have any moral high ground to impose your values on anyone else here and you’ve had plenty of incidents of ridiculous personal attacks too. In UP, everyone’s a troll simply from participating so stop pretending that there are any boundaries that shouldn’t be broached.

This place went to shit as soon as Trump became acceptable to all the conservative posters here. Accept the shit you wallow and stop with the moral waygating you pretentious dick.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Wed Sep 01 14:07:21
"What convention are you enforcing"

It's about which one's you are breaking.

"Decency doesn’t exist on this forum."

Not true at all, this is a fiction you have told yourself.

"impose your values"

It's not just my values, it is one of the values that is universally accepted, even when they execute murderers that convention is respected. Not respecting the spirit or the body of the dead is actually actually one of the last conventions of civility before unimaginable savage anarchy and bloody mayhem.

The fact that you don't seem to understand this, is actually worse than the act itself. It suggests there actually is no bottom to the abyss inside you.
Hrothgar
Member
Wed Sep 01 19:06:10
Welcome back. You are still alive. Congrats. Hot Rod didn't make it, but he would have been anti-vax and died of covid anyhow about a year and a half later, so maybe he died an easier way than struggling for breath in a hospital.

I haven't changed much perspective wise since a few years after 9/11. Give me liberal Republicans and Conservative Democrats running things and it's about right.

It's pretty sad that it's down to "which candidate is capable of speaking in a reasonable, reasoned, stoic way, hasn't paid hookers for silence in the last 15 years, and won't try to destroy the institutions of the Republic to win a lost vote." as my determination on who to vote for.
murder
Member
Wed Sep 01 19:13:54

"Thankfully they've got me on something that works wonderfully. The arthritis attack was actually a big tell that the gut issues may have been something else and the change of medicine has pretty much stopped all my symptoms."

It's good to hear that you're doing better. Hopefully that medication holds up long term and your condition doesn't worsen.

Sam Adams
Member
Wed Sep 01 21:20:20
"Brazenly Racist and Misogynistic things"

Lol, cuckhat got so butthurt that we used naughty words about he became a total scumbag.
OsamaIsDaWorstPresid
Member
Thu Sep 02 01:31:31
"My medical issues prevented reinlistment and the civilian sector was not hiring."

y dus a broken ashole stop u kilin ragis
Habebe
Member
Thu Sep 02 03:10:15
As the military becomes more woke a more robust rectum is required.
OsamaIsDaWorstPresid
Member
Thu Sep 02 03:52:30
im imagening a dril sergint inspectin airosis ashole

aftar inspektin airoses ass he desides its not up 2 spec and screems into2 da asshole, theres a echo and da screem echos bak in2 da dril sergents face causin airos 2 b kiked outa da milatrie
Cloud Strife
Member
Thu Sep 02 04:22:14
"You gotta go home son. Your asshole can't take the pounding that's demanded."
OsamaIsDaWorstPresid
Member
Thu Sep 02 13:31:52
mebe sum1 shuld do reserch in2 cibernetic asshole implantes 4 airos kinda leik a robotic ashole combined wit a fleshlite 2 implant 4 him
obaminated
Member
Thu Sep 02 20:39:17
This place is purgatory aeros, and we are all stuck here.
PhunkyPhishStyle
Member
Mon Sep 06 09:05:42
So just performing the ol’ monthly UP checkup and see Aeros has returned and gone full QTard?
Dukhat
Member
Mon Sep 06 09:12:02
It's not Aeros. It's TC fucking around with Aeros account. I remain hopeful that Aeros was never stupid enough to fall for this shit and is living a happy life with his wife and daughter.
Forwyn
Member
Mon Sep 06 09:31:32
"Acknowleding the active dissemination of lies by legacy media makes you a full QTard" - Cuckhat and...PPS?
Habebe
Member
Mon Sep 06 10:33:44
The really strange thing is that your all just figments of my imagination, your literally only here becuase Ive thought you into existence.
Dukhat
Member
Mon Sep 06 19:07:45
The "lies" told by the mainstream media. Please demonstrate in kind asshole whereas I can count dozens being promulgated at any one time by conservative media.

If the liberal media tells a lie, they retract and fix. If conservative media tells a lie, they double down. It's beyond retarded.
Dukhat
Member
Mon Sep 06 19:21:45
There is no liberal media anyways. Mainstream media is as pro-corporate as conservative media.
nhill
Member
Mon Sep 06 23:54:50
^this

Corporate media is more accurate depiction. Just so happens that corporate media (include Fox News) panders heavier to the liberal side. A reflection of the population.

Google, Facebook, and Twitter are not liberal, either. They are optimizing their revenue streams for the zeitgeist.

Hate to see it, but that's the truth.
nhill
Member
Mon Sep 06 23:57:21
I was on record in these forums saying Twitter banning Donald Trump was a smart business move.

Guess what. Market agrees with me. After an initial dump by butthurt conservatives I was able to pick up a huge bag of Twitter stock on the cheap.

And their latest earnings report was a fucking beauty. Good on them for understanding how to shore up their core user base and pump their revenue streams.

Trump is not only irrelevant to Twitter, he made them less money on the platform than off. lmao, that's gotta hurt the Trumpies.
nhill
Member
Mon Sep 06 23:59:53
BTW no other person here publicly had the balls to say Twitter banning Trump was a smart business move. Despite their stock tanking about 10-15% (I forget) from the move.

This is the vision you get from not cheering for either side. :)
Habebe
Member
Tue Sep 07 01:35:51
"Google, Facebook, and Twitter are not liberal, either. They are optimizing their revenue streams for the zeitgeist."

I'm going to have to disagree with that.

There is more to it than those companies JUST going after the $.Dont get me wrong, it happens (spotify keeping Rogan)

But they are going after the money from an ideology.Its the biggest flaw in classical economics IMHO that people act economically in a compartmentalized manner.

Murdoch went after the money, but still acted within his ideology.
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 01:38:38
You simply don't understand how artificial intelligence works, Habebe. And that's okay. But what you are seeing is recurrent neural network optimizations, not liberal bias.

I will die on this hill, being a coder of similar algorithms. They naturally optimize for the zeitgeist.

When a conservative is "shadow-banned" from Google it's because the search term they previously ranked high on didn't generate as much adwords revenue.

Facts.
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 01:40:06
I'm not even talking about economics, either. This is how neural networks work.
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 01:41:07
Just so happens that this neural network was trained on revenue. :)

Like all major social media company AI models.

But people want to cry liberal bias, so be it.
Habebe
Member
Tue Sep 07 02:11:11
Nhill, The thing is that, the peoplenin these corporations make decisions.

Did the neural network decide for big tech to get in bed with the DNC fornthe 2020 shadow campaign o "fortify" the election? I dont think so.

It was probably a mix of things and them betting that it was safer to get into bed with Biden than Trump, but to think these corporations act in a manner SOLEY to earn money and not factoring in personal bias of the employees seems short sighted.

People are motivated by all sorts of things.

Yes, fair enough people will call bias when its not there, happens all the time. Twitter for example is a liberal company, with liberal employees, they act with that bias built in.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Tue Sep 07 02:18:03
I think it was David Pakman and some other people on youtube that actually showed what Nhill is saying with figures. Even when youtube sawed independent producers at the knees in favor of authorative sources, they bumped Foxnews (and cnn msnbc etc).

Regardless of the source that is regulating, it isn’t a positive development, we need news sources and media to question things, especially the prevailing culture and zeitgeist.

Not saying you disagree ( I don’t know) but there is more to twitter for us to care about that how cheap we can buy the stocks. Maybe it was too good to be true, that everyone could be on twitter and we had these spaces _everyone_ could live in, but that idea sounds better than half a dozen twitters, that in many says start to look like the old media, but now they are powered by technology that makes it very difficult to change the ”station”, it just keeps showing you more and more of whatever it is you already believe.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Tue Sep 07 02:27:09
I think it was David Pakman and some other people on youtube that actually showed what Nhill is saying with figures. Even when youtube sawed independent producers at the knees in favor of authorative sources, they bumped Foxnews (and cnn msnbc etc).

Regardless of the source that is regulating, it isn’t a positive development, we need news sources and media to question things, especially the prevailing culture and zeitgeist.

Not saying you disagree ( I don’t know) but there is more to twitter for us to care about that how cheap we can buy the stocks. Maybe it was too good to be true, that everyone could be on twitter and we had these spaces _everyone_ could live in, but that idea sounds better than half a dozen twitters, that in many says start to look like the old media, but now they are powered by technology that makes it very difficult to change the ”station”, it just keeps showing you more and more of whatever it is you already believe.
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 02:31:09
I like that angle. Yes, I find the intrinsic bias disconcerting. That’s why I went with LEAP stock options instead of common stock. It doesn’t contribute to their market cap.

But it was a business decision, and I don’t have a problem putting my feelings aside to make a smart move, provided I can do so in a neutral way (stock option writers are primarily trying to stay gamma neutral so my flipping off the options does not award the company any capital until they are exercised down the road).
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 02:37:47
> It was probably a mix of things and them betting that it was safer to get into bed with Biden than Trump, but to think these corporations act in a manner SOLEY to earn money and not factoring in personal bias of the employees seems short sighted.

Your position is short-sighted and can only be postulated by someone that doesn’t understand artificial intelligence.

You don’t “code” liberal or conservative bias into algorithms in the way you are picturing. These things aren’t that simple. You feed data into it and a black box optimizes for revenue. Math, not feelings.
Habebe
Member
Tue Sep 07 02:47:22
Nhill, The thing is the AI is not making every decision of Twitter.Im not saying the code was intentionally bias, I'm saying that Jack Dorsey doesn't have an algorithm making all of his decisions.

Shadow bans may not be bias.But Twitter makes more decisions than just what their AI decides, otherwise Dorsey wouldn't have a job.
Habebe
Member
Tue Sep 07 02:48:39
News Corp uses algorithms, it doesn't mean its not a conservative Corporation.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Tue Sep 07 02:52:04
Nhill
"You don’t “code” liberal or conservative bias into algorithms in the way you are picturing."

However it was done, if we take youtube, in several waves that algorithm was modified to down rank certain stuff and source, despite audience popularity, which in the political section of youtube, was dominated by rightwingers and conservatives. Then we begin to see the inherent problems with this:

"you feed data into it and a black box optimizes for revenue. Math, not feelings."

Because we are talking about platforms that have become extremely important for our democratic process, so much that they are being used to manipulate election outcomes. But that platform is run by an algorithm that reinforces the "zeitgeist". There there, now go an update your credit card info and renew your Netflix subscription and buy some of these supplements.

:(
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Tue Sep 07 02:57:13
"The thing is the AI is not making every decision of Twitter."

Right, the updates to twitter or youtube guidelines, that makes it a violation of to "dead name" people or bans people for life for saying "men are not women", these are not the works of an algorithm but the works of human "panels" populated with people with rather clear motives and insular pedigree. Then at the end of that you have an AI to enforce the rules that the liberal minded "community panels" drafted.

Besides, many of these things, while at the first level handled by AI's is often reviewed by humans upon appeal.
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 03:25:58
Yes, certainly the rule violations and setting are controlled by humans (and also used as inputs into the AI.

But in the end, if the AI said it wasn't profitable to continue, they would not continue. To assume these tech bros like Jack Dorsey have a nefarious devotion to an ideology over money is silly.

Society is what dictates big tech content. The proof is in the earnings.
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 03:27:43
I agree with all those problems Nimatzo. I'm not happy with the situation. But to put the blame on Jack Dorsey is idiotic. He could get jettisoned to Mars without a spacesuit and the bias would remain, as the bias is the reflection of the collective. All the numbers back this up (just look at any earnings report).
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 03:29:59
Was the decision to ban Trump based on an AI? No, of course not.

That does nothing to refute my point, in face it supports it. This decision to ban Trump ended up reflecting positively on their quarter's earnings.

The people have spoken with their most valuable currency, Attention.
Habebe
Member
Tue Sep 07 03:44:36
Nhill, I'm not saying its nefarious, I one is the bad guy in their own story.

As for Dorsey, its not JUST becuase of him, he is just an easy example to hone in on.The collective inputs but a smaller inner circle has far more say, an inner circle comprised of silicon valley workers.

Its like Austrian economic theory that finds people.are motivated by more than just direct finances.

as for banning Trump it may have been a good decision, mabey not, only time will tell.

Their earnings would good, but likley would have been either way.Parlor was a bust, but now he is in talks with another platform to get partial ownership, plus there is now a large group of people calling on Congress to looknintontheir influence and such, in ten years theybmayblook back and see this as a bad move, or not.
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 03:52:32
The earnings report detailed user engagement metrics over time, and after the Trump ban, all their metrics improved... even more than estimated.

If banning Trump was a bad decision, it would have already been evident. Of course banning Trump was a good decision for them, lol. Look at their core userbase. They loved the decision and lauded them with praise for it. Are you that much out of touch with the next generation? We're old farts to them, brother.

Also: I'm terrible at microeconomics, but I know enough that any business that caters to their core user base is going to see benefits (both short & long-term).
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Tue Sep 07 04:04:51
"But in the end, if the AI said it wasn't profitable to continue"

Profits are I would agree one of the key things. So this examples which captures the first "adpocalypse" on youtube set off by pewdiepie and that "nazi" video, is very interesting. That fear that made the advertisers flee, was a concerted propaganda effort by the old media. They made up bald faced lies and wrote hit pieces about that channel that set off a stampede. That forced youtube to do something, among other things change the algo and ultimately down rank independent sources in favor of the institutional ones. Because youtube is/was very popular among right wingers and conservatives, it compounded their fears about the prevailing liberal bias in tech.

Something can be made unprofitable on youtube like that, that while based on lies and half truths, they lies are concordant with the zeitgiest, in this case "nazis are bad". The overwhelming majority of youtube hadn't followed pewdiepie despite being one of the largest channels. They couldn't upon contact dismiss the hitpieces for what they were, lies.

"But to put the blame on Jack Dorsey is idiotic."

It's bigger than Jack, I agree. Some of these things are just inherent to the scale of the medium. Makes outrage activism that much easier. You get 50k retweets and no one is questioning, are these retweets even from the appropriate constituency? Are they even all supportive? Is 50K even a significant number on a platform with hundreds of millions of accounts?

It was funny to learn the Pareto principle of twitter, something like 5% of the twitter population producing 80% of the content and those 5% are actually an even smaller minority of the actual US population!

Though I have to say, the profit motive is itself a problem when it collides with the mission, in this case the mission of the 4th estate. Topics can be made so toxic for profits that you just stay away. You don't even have to make up lies, you just don't talk about it.

I was myself initially bamboozled by the obvious bias as the THE source. Because that is what is starring and often yelling in your face, if you are the kind of person seeking political debates.
Habebe
Member
Tue Sep 07 04:28:49
Nhill, Zen Master says we'll see.

http://youtu.be/B2L1-TgfKb4

Odds are it was a good move for them to ban Trump, but we'll see.If the Republicans and Trump get back in office, mabey not.
Pillz
Member
Tue Sep 07 05:26:00
All. Nhill is saying and advocating for is pandering and catering to the most common, basal wants and fears and opinions of the masses to make money.

And while it's right, I hope they all die.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Tue Sep 07 05:46:49
I don't interpret him at all advocating that, but that his investor mindset sees opportunity to make money, where other minds are only preoccupied with the political debate. There is nothing wrong with that, he finds ways to capitalize on political outrage :)

I actually admire his dispassion, given that neither he nor you nor I can control any of this, why not assuage your frustration by making money on the very thing that frustrates you?
Cloud Strife
Member
Tue Sep 07 06:09:49
I especially love the vague claims of making money based on claims of "I was the only one who called it."

I mean, you usually have to turn on the TV to see this level of self-fellating bullshit.
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 08:58:24
Oof, you fell right into that one. The only things I’m better at than making money is baiting the jealous and insecure.

*plays Another One Bites The Dust*
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 10:06:17
Nim

Thanks for the explanation, that's accurate. I'm happy as long as I can identify opportunity & capitalize without scruples. I possess high levels of autistic tendencies so dispassionate is my base state. Might as well leverage it.
nhill
Member
Tue Sep 07 10:13:43
Pillz

There was no advocation to be found from me, it was merely exposition. The money I made off the Twitter opportunity was through LEAP stock options, i.e. my capital was never employed at Twitter. Whomever is the exerciser of the options will have to make that moral call, not me.

I don't like the way technology cultivates and encourages ideological bubbles and echo chambers as part of public optimizing revenue streams, but that's how it works.
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