Utopia Talk / Politics / Brexit: petrol stations shut down

EuropeanPussy Member	Thu Sep 23 15:16:39 http://www...river-shortage-itv-2021-09-23/ BP closes UK gas stations due to truck shortages LONDON, Sept 23 (Reuters) - Oil company BP (BP.L) said on Thursday it had temporarily closed some of its petrol forecourts in Britain after its ability to transport fuel from refineries was hit by an industry wide shortage of truck drivers. "We are experiencing some fuel supply issues at some of our retail sites in the UK and unfortunately have therefore seen a handful of sites temporarily close due to a lack of both unleaded and diesel grades," BP said in a statement on Thursday. BP, which has about 1,200 branded stations across the United Kingdom, said it was taking action to address the issue. "We continue to work with our haulier supplier to minimise any future disruption and to ensure efficient and effective deliveries to serve our customers," it said. BP said it was prioritising deliveries to motorway service areas, major trunk roads and sites with the largest demand and seeking to minimise the duration of "stock outs". ExxonMobil's (XOM.N) Esso said a small number of its 200 Tesco Alliance (TSCO.L) retail sites in the UK had also been impacted. "We are working closely with all parties in our distribution network to optimise supplies and minimise any inconvenience to customers," it said in a statement. The Petrol Retailers Association (PRA), which represents independent forecourts that account for 65 percent of Britain's petrol stations, said the issues appeared to be confined to London and southeast England, and appeared temporary. "According to latest BEIS (business department) data, fuel demand is still only at 92% of pre-pandemic levels so we believe there should be ample stock available at refineries and delivery terminals throughout the UK," the PRA's Gordon Balmer said. The drivers' shortage has also caused widespread disruption to Britain's food sector. read more The trucking industry has said it needs another 90,000 drivers to meet demand after Brexit made it harder for European workers to drive in Britain and the COVID-19 pandemic prevented new workers from qualifying.
murder Member	Thu Sep 23 15:37:00 Doing its part to fight global warming. :o)
Pillz Member	Thu Sep 23 17:07:34 Has nothing to do with brexit
Paramount Member	Fri Sep 24 11:15:05 The trucking industry says: ”Brexit made it harder for European workers to drive in Britain” Not sure what the unemployment rate in Britain is, but they could educate 90,000 unemployed brits on how to drive a truck.
CrownRoyal Member	Fri Sep 24 12:06:13 Next step: asking foreigners for help Supply chain crisis: Tories poised to U-turn on foreign worker visas Boris Johnson believed to have overruled ministers unwilling to compromise on post-Brexit immigration as forecourt queues mount Fri 24 Sep 2021 17.53 BST Ministers are poised to agree an extraordinary post-Brexit U-turn that would see foreign lorry drivers allowed back into the UK to stave off shortages threatening fuel and food supplies. Boris Johnson ordered a rapid fix on Friday to prevent the crisis escalating. Ministers met in a bid to agree a short-term visa scheme permitting potentially thousands more lorry drivers from abroad to come to the UK. The prime minister is understood to have weighed in to demand a compromise from his warring cabinet, which was split over the issue, following scenes of chaotic queues at some petrol stations and warnings from suppliers that the shortage of fuel on forecourts could worsen. The shortage of up 100,000 heavy goods vehicle (HGV) drivers – exacerbated by the pandemic and Brexit – has also impacted the food sector and other industries. The British Retail Consortium warned on Friday that significant disruption to Christmas was “inevitable” unless the problem is contained in the next 10 days… … On Friday night, cabinet sources insisted that discussions were still ongoing, but the plan was expected to be signed off over the weekend. The move will be seen as a remarkable climbdown, as Johnson’s Brexit campaign was founded on giving the UK more control over immigration and ending free movement. It is likely that other sectors suffering from labour shortages – such as hospitality – will now put pressure on ministers to grant them exemptions as well. Cont http://www...ised-turn-foreign-worker-visas
Seb Member	Fri Sep 24 16:26:45 Pillz: Has everything to do with brexit - there's a shortage of hgv drivers because far fewer hgv's make journeys between EU and UK as it's no longer economical, so there's a smaller fleet servicing UK only journeys; and a shortage of drivers in the UK as many were EU citizens and left.
Seb Member	Fri Sep 24 16:28:12 Paramount: "Not sure what the unemployment rate in Britain is, but they could educate 90,000 unemployed brits on how to drive a truck." Yeah, we totes have capacity to train 90,000 unemployed brits to safely drive hgvs in a few weeks. There are just loads of teachers and spare rigs to train them on.
Forwyn Member	Fri Sep 24 23:07:48 "Yeah, we totes have capacity to train 90,000 unemployed brits to safely drive hgvs in a few weeks. There are just loads of teachers and spare rigs to train them on." Spare the sarcasm. Every trucking company has the ability to double their load capacity in six months. They're just enjoying their record profit margins.
Nekran Member	Sat Sep 25 03:05:04 "Every trucking company has the ability to double their load capacity in six months." Lol!
Seb Member	Sat Sep 25 03:18:45 Forwyn: Recruiting and training 90,000 hgv truckers at the wages that Bulgarians work at will have no impact on truckers margins and costs. Sadly Trucking companies don't run the testing centres or issues licences. I'm sure many have plans to expand under normal conditions as they get more market share, but they probably weren't anticipating a massive systemic shock.
murder Member	Sat Sep 25 06:33:45 "Yeah, we totes have capacity to train 90,000 unemployed brits to safely drive hgvs in a few weeks." Go driverless. ;o)
Paramount Member	Sat Sep 25 11:17:02 I heard that Boris Johnson has a plan. He is going to change the law so that it allows foreigners to work as drivers in Britain. Kinda like it was in pre-Brexit I guess. Lol
Seb Member	Sat Sep 25 13:21:32 So he's ended freedom of movement, but only for Brits. Slow hand clap.
shannon Member	Sat Sep 25 15:58:10 Boris Johnson has warned firms to increase lorry drivers’ wages, as ministers urged 40,000 retired HGV licence holders to return to work to help refill petrol stations and deliver supplies to supermarkets. A senior government source said that a temporary relaxation of rules allowing more EU workers to help replenish a shortage of drivers in Britain would only “run up to Christmas” because “we need to be paying these people more rather than just flooding the market with cheap labour”. Tens of thousands of well paid jobs for British workers. Remainiacs and Europeans are sad.
Seb Member	Sat Sep 25 16:10:29 Shannon: Except th0e conditions are shit which is why there's a huge deficit, and the pay is shit. And if they pay more, then cost of goods go up. Yay inflation.
Seb Member	Sun Sep 26 02:41:31 this is like the whole fruit picker argument redux. "Hundreds of thousands of new well paid jobs" - only they are not well paid jobs, you can't find people willing to do them, and at the price people are willing to do them, the goods aren't competitive, so they rot in the fiel.
Seb Member	Sun Sep 26 05:03:00 I'm not sure if vote leave had campaigned on "bring back the wage-price inflationary cycle" they would have won. The whole project is a return to the 1970s really, isn't it. State subsidies for uncompetitive business, capital controls, shit food, high inflation and the eventual currency crisis; while standards of living slip further back from the European average. This is why none of you lunatics should ever be let near power. You are utterly clueless.
Rugian Member	Sun Sep 26 09:59:32 The United States went through a severe economic depression in the aftermath of the Revolutionary War. Such growing pains are the norm for newly free countries. In the long run, it's a price well worth paying in order to lose the shackles of your imperial overlords.
Paramount Member	Sun Sep 26 11:33:14 When will all the american states break free from the imperial overlords in D.C? Isn’t it only when they leave the federation that they can be free countries?
shannon Member	Sun Sep 26 11:56:03 Lol poor Seb cannot bear the thought of British people who do a productive days work to be paid properly. It’s so offensive to his bloviated sense of entitlement. Removing low paid foreign workers from the UK labour market is good for British workers. Deal with it. There is a huge pool of experienced British drivers available. They just need to be offered the market rate for their labour. For too long they have been stuffed by warped foreign labour imports. Seb isn’t the last Remainiac left in the UK, but he is still an hysterical member of that shrinking fraternity. Inflation might have something to do with money supply don’t you think Seb? How much new money has the BoE created in the past few years by buying HMG bonds? You haven’t the first idea about economics, which is why EUrotwats like you were thrown out of power.
Seb Member	Sun Sep 26 12:51:22 Shannon: "Removing low paid foreign workers from the UK labour market is good for British workers" Firstly no, because unemployment is low. Secondly, it is not good for British workers because it is more than offset by increased cost of living. As we saw in the 1970s. "There is a huge pool of experienced British drivers available" Yes, but they all left because the job is shit and they found better jobs that are more economically productive. So if they can be tempted back by higher wages, that will result in staff shortages in the industries they are currently in, and lower aggregate output; and the increased costs of transporting goods paid proportionately by the lowest paid as they are the ones who spend most of their disposable income on goods.
Seb Member	Sun Sep 26 12:53:22 "Inflation might have something to do with money supply don’t you think Seb?" Not always. It's a common belief that inflation is purely a monetary phenomenon. This is incorrect. The dominant cause of inflation in he 70s was a wage price spiral. It is also what we are seeing now.
Seb Member	Sun Sep 26 12:54:35 Let's see: Gas and energy price hikes, fuel shortages, food and goods shortages... These were all supposed to be project fear. And yet here we are.
shannon Member	Sun Sep 26 12:57:06 Bullshit Seb. Drivers were furloughed during lockdowns. They have not returned to work. New driving training was suspended which made a bad situation worse. There is no threat of inflation from paying a few tens of thousands of truck drivers a decent wage. That inflation comes from money printing. Buy gold and silver… As always the Remainiacs show their contempt for those they wrongly consider their working class inferiors. Too bad Seb. Remainiacs will never again get the opportunity to wage war on British workers.
shannon Member	Sun Sep 26 12:59:39 “Project fear” only came about after Covid shutdowns and restrictions. Funny that you would think it’s Brexit. But not really. Just Remainiacs being consistently prevaricating.
shannon Member	Sun Sep 26 13:06:18 Inflation is always due to increase in money supply. It’s literally an inflation of money supply leading to increase in the cost of consumer goods. The1970s inflation occurred directly as a result of President Nixon “temporarily” breaking the Gold Exchange with a fixed USD. Everything flowed on from that. If you think inflation was kicked off by workers being paid more then lol you seriously are incredibly ignorant. Once prices rose then wage demands followed. Not the other way around.
Seb Member	Sun Sep 26 14:22:05 Shannon: "Bullshit Seb. Drivers were furloughed during lockdowns. They have not returned to work." Most drivers are self employed contractors and not eligible for furlough. IR35 has had a big effect. "There is no threat of inflation from paying a few tens of thousands of truck drivers a decent wage." And the social care workers, and the agricultural workers, and the health care workers. There are staff shortages all over the shop. "“Project fear” only came about after Covid shutdowns and restrictions." Lol, yes, and that's why the rest of the continent that had stronger shut downs than here are doing so much worse than the UK on all these issues... oh... wait... The UK didn't leave the transition period until Jan 2021. Until then, EU rules applied. So yes, we didn't start to see this shit until this year. "Wage price spirals do not exist" is simply an absurd position to take.
Forwyn Member	Sun Sep 26 22:18:37 "Sadly Trucking companies don't run the testing centres or issues licences." Correct. Otherwise they would have been up and running, getting new drivers on the road and avoiding your crisis. But government faggots love sitting at home collecting a paycheck. Even here, when the market is under extreme demand and everyone is working their tail off, you can always depend on a fucking revenue office or courthouse being closed.
Cloud Strife Member	Mon Sep 27 04:36:06 British economy continues collapsing, surprising few. As for inflation. If the labor market demands higher wages, you already have inflation. You can't undo it by abusing labor, and refusing to raise wages. Supply meet demand. Shortages = raise prices.
Seb Member	Mon Sep 27 05:51:22 Forwyn: DVSA doesn't staff the test centres. They are privately run. DVSA shut down testing largely as a cost saving measure. Cloud strife: Point is, if you restrict your pool of labour to a small island with high living costs; and restrict the number of customers that costs can be spread over, that is inherently going to drive up labour costs and reduce efficiency. These are inflationary pressures.
Seb Member	Mon Sep 27 06:58:55 I wonder if forwyn connects the closure of public services with not funding them in the name is lower taxes.
Cloud Strife Member	Mon Sep 27 07:45:38 You want to call a raise in prices (in this case wages) "inflationary pressure", that's fine. It's more accurate to just cause it "inflation" though. I would say that "inflationary pressure" is exerted by the increased trade barriers, which leads to a reduction in supply (e.g. labor), i.e. a contraction in real economic output, which absent a corresponding contraction of the money supply gives inflation.
Seb Member	Mon Sep 27 09:02:38 Cloud Strife: Fair point - by "pressure" I was trying to capture the point that while these are initially one off systemic shocks, what then happens when you raise prices to try and attract more staff is that you pass those increased costs back into the system, further eroding standards of living, driving more demand for further wage rises... and off you go. And when employment is full, far from leading to "more well paid jobs for brits", is you end up with rapidly rising wage demands across multiple sectors. And where wages are rising fast at the margin to fill even small gaps in staff rosters, this quickly results in demands for wage rises for the rest of the workforce. It can get nasty very quickly.
Seb Member	Mon Sep 27 09:03:36 "Raise wages to try and attract..." Its one of those days...
Forwyn Member	Mon Sep 27 12:34:21 "They are privately run." Wholly irrelevant, when they are forced to shutter based on the whims of the bureaucracy. "DVSA shut down testing largely as a cost saving measure." And the industry was screaming about it months ago. To that end, I retract my initial statement - at least here, companies are only cautiously expanding, scared the bottom will drop out any time - and turning down new freight. Your guys have been trying and failing to test new hires. Lmfao Nov 10, 2020 The Logistics Skills Network (LSN) has slammed the DVSA’s decision to suspend HGV driver testing and training during the government’s latest four-week lockdown in England, which began last week. The LSN, whose members train around 40% of all HGV drivers each year, is warning that the decision will add thousands more delayed tests to the existing backlog of 20,000 delayed HGV tests created by the previous lockdown and exacerbate the HGV driver shortage in the middle of the logistics industry’s peak period. In a letter sent to DVSA chief executive Gareth Llewellyn, the LSN calls for the suspension of testing and training to be reversed “immediately”. The letter, written by LSN chairman David Coombes, argues that nothing in the Statutory Instrument (SI) regulations approved by Parliament to enable this latest lockdown legally requires HGV driver training and testing to cease. He adds; “In fact, quite the opposite. The SI makes a specific exception to the lockdown regulations where the purpose is education and training. Clearly the training of vocational drivers falls under this category and is therefore exempt.” The letter, which has also been copied to DfT minister Baroness Vere of Norbiton and Conservative MP Huw Merriman, also warns of the damage the suspension of HGV training and testing will have on the haulage industry and the wider economy. Pointing out that the suspension of testing in the first pandemic lockdown had created a backlog of around 20,000 HGV tests, Coombes warns that applying the same suspension across the second lockdown will create a further backlog of around 6,000 HGV tests which, he adds, will have “serious consequences for the economy just when the logistics industry is gearing up for peak. By the end of the four-week lockdown we will have lost the capacity to deliver 40,000 tonnes of food, medicinal supplies and other freight every day.” The RHA also voiced its concern this week. Tom Cotton, RHA head of policy for England and Wales, said any suspension of HGV driver tests will exacerbate the severe shortage of HGV drivers in the UK. He said: “When vocational testing is suspended this only compounds the driver shortage in this country, which currently stands at a shortfall of around 60,0000 drivers, and creates additional problems for our members.” DVSA has yet to respond to a request from motortransport.co.uk for comment. http://mot...pt-peak-season-industry-warns/
Forwyn Member	Mon Sep 27 12:43:30 "I wonder if forwyn connects the closure of public services with not funding them in the name is lower taxes." Surely you have a tranny Muslim outreach program to put on hold instead of bottlenecking the lifeblood of your economy?
Seb Member	Mon Sep 27 12:57:05 Forwyn: "And the industry was screaming about it months ago." So blame the Tories. Shutting down DVSA was a decision made by Sunak and Schapps to save cash because they don't want to raise taxes further. This has fuck all to do with people sitting home collecting a paycheck. Also, I am pretty sure driving test examiners are also private contractors and so not eligible for furlough. Do you think though, that the ministers that managed to screw this up badly, maybe also didn't have the faintest fucking clue about the implications of Brexit also? "Surely you have a tranny Muslim outreach program" I love how you guys invent all this imagined shit, while the reality is we have the Hostile Environment program, where we deport people born in the UK 60 years ago to random Caribbean countries because the only evidence their parents were legal immigrants was their boarding cards, which were held by the Home Office, which they decided to destroy, precisely so they could deport the people in question.
nhill Member	Mon Sep 27 13:14:53 To be fair, deporting them to the Caribbean from the UK is doing many of them a favor.
Habebe Member	Mon Sep 27 14:33:11 http://www...-announces-special-guests/amp/ Not too far off really, its just not a government program....yet. The world’s first Muslim Pride is taking place in London this year. LGBTQ charity Imaan will mark its 20th anniversary of supporting lesbian, gay, bisexual, trans and queer Muslims by hosting a festival in London on Saturday 11 April to celebrate what it means to be both queer and Muslim. ------ Tranny Muslim outreach is a real thing though.
Seb Member	Mon Sep 27 15:14:30 Habebe: You don't believe this is govt funded do you? Are you basically just mad that civic society celebrates gay muslims?
Hrothgar Member	Tue Sep 28 09:53:52 I have a hard time deciding which was the bigger self own: - US electing Trump, and the long term fallout from that dibacle. - UK and Brexit. There will be decade+ long economic damaging fallout from that for very little real benefit of the citizens of the UK.
Seb Member	Tue Sep 28 13:31:57 Hrothgar: Very difficult to tell. The US surprising situation is more reversible I think.
Nimatzo iChihuaha	Tue Sep 28 14:37:22 The check and balances keeps the US president from doing anything really stupid against the USA, they can fuck up other places, but on this Trump was far from the worst offender. The same can not be said about the UK. Whatever checks and balances there were they failed to keep the British people from, as one youtuber said, burn down the house, so they could change the handles of the kitchen cupboards.
Seb Member	Tue Sep 28 15:55:16 Nim: Not really. The equivalent of leaving the EU was opting out of TPTP, Nafta changes and withdrawing from the Iran treaty. A US president can easily do the equivalent of leaving the EU - the difference is not institutional there at all. The difference is the UK is very much more reliant on EU membership and international frameworks - not just to leverage power but as a source of power; whereas the US has a lot of internal strength to fall back on. The impact to the US will be in the opportunity costs of removing itself from a position of leadership in global rule and norm setting, and take much longer to play out.
Paramount Member	Sat Oct 02 01:47:23 There are more than one million job vacancies in the UK, a new record since surveys began in 2001. According to the Institute for Fiscal Studies, the vast majority of job vacancies are in traditional low-wage industries where warehouse workers, truck drivers and restaurant staff are examples of the shortage. - We advertise but get no answers. The recruitment company we usually use to fill temporary gaps cannot offer anything at all. I have colleagues who are forced to close some days because they do not get staff. I do not know how long we will be able to cope with this situation, says Heath Ball who runs a gastropub in north London. It is a combination of Brexit and the corona pandemic that has caused the recruitment problems. The British government wants domestic staff to fill the gaps, while large sections of the business community want it to be easier to bring in labor from the EU. The government recently announced the release of 5,000 temporary visas for EU truck drivers to solve the acute transport crisis, which has caused petrol shortages, among other things. But business organizations are calling for more such initiatives for other shortages as well. There is concern about what will happen now that the government's extensive redundancy support has ended. Most observers believe that unemployment will increase slightly, it is unclear how much. Among the industries that had the most employees with redundancy support and that are hardest hit when the support is removed are the aviation industry and the tourism industry. Cabin crew and travel agents who lose their jobs will not necessarily want to take jobs in bars or warehouses. They can choose to be unemployed for a longer period of time instead, says Tony Wilson, head of the Institute for Employment Studies to the Financial Times. Chris Gray, who is head of British Manpower, tells SVT that he does not believe that the labor shortage will decrease. And he is supported by pub owner Heath Ball: - In this country, you want others to do the jobs for them, but you do not want foreigners in the country. Englishmen do not want to work in the restaurant industry, they do not want to drive trucks, they do not want to be dishwashers. So who is going to do these jobs, Heath Ball wonders. http://www...a-lediga-jobb-i-storbritannien So there are a record number of available jobs in Britain, but the brits does not want the jobs. They want foreigners to do the low-wage jobs. But the brits does not want foreigners in their country. So now the brits are quarrelling at the petrol queues and wants the military to step in as truck drivers. Will the military help to serve beer and clean the toilets at the pubs also? :)
Daemon Member	Sat Oct 02 06:41:55 Germans to the front! http://www...shortage-germans-b1930558.html Government asks German residents to drive lorries even if they never have before Exclusive: German driving licences issued before 1999 include entitlement to drive a small to medium-sized truck of up to 7.5 tonnes The government has asked thousands of Germans residing in the UK to drive lorries to assist with the HGV shortage, even if they have never driven one before. A letter was sent by the Department for Transport, signed by transport minister Baroness Vere, asking Germans who live in Britain to “consider returning” to the HGV driving sector. The letter states: “Your valuable skills and experience have never been more needed than they are now. “There are fantastic HGV driving opportunities in the logistics industry and conditions of employment have been improving across the sector. As well as attractive pay rates, we are seeing more options for flexible working, fixed hours, fixed days, full time and part time.” German driving licences issued before 1999 include an entitlement to drive a small to medium-sized truck of up to 7.5 tonnes. It is understood that almost all Germans residing in the UK who hold such a licence have been sent the letter, almost none of whom have ever driven an HGV before. One 41-year-old German man, who received two copies of the letter at his London home on Friday morning, one addressed to him and another for his wife, told The Independent. “We were quite surprised,” he said. “I’m sure pay and conditions for HGV drivers have improved, but ultimately I have decided to carry on in my role at an investment bank. My wife has never driven anything larger than a Volvo, so she is also intending to decline the exciting opportunity. “It is nice to know there are specialist jobs available here for us though after Brexit. We would never have been headhunted to drive a lorry if we’d gone back to Germany.” (...)
Paramount Member	Sat Oct 02 08:24:56 ” We were quite surprised,” he said. “I’m sure pay and conditions for HGV drivers have improved, but ultimately I have decided to carry on in my role at an investment bank” Lol. So now Germans living in London are being asked to quit their well paid jobs at investment banks to drive trucks instead?
TheChildren Member	Sat Oct 02 13:18:59 yea shit bad now man. but it gonna get way worse. tis gonna be bad dude winter. im already panick stockin all kinds of beans and cans.
TheChildren Member	Sat Oct 02 13:20:31 i didnt like vanguard that much but maybe i lock myself in and get vanguard and play that shit this winter... eatin food thats readily available and can be heated with microwave 2 avoid gas. im thinkin wearin a thick coat around house 2 keep billz down...
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