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Utopia Talk / Politics / Trains suck
Rugian
Member
Wed Jan 11 18:18:10
Amtrak train delayed for 37 hours prompts passengers to call 911 over ‘hostage’ fears

By Isabel Keane

January 11, 2023 5:04pm Updated

An Amtrak train got stranded for 37 hours in South Carolina — leaving passengers so panicked, they were calling 911 believing they were being held hostage.

The Auto Train left Virginia at 5 p.m. Monday and was supposed to reach Orlando, Fla. by 10 a.m. Tuesday — but was forced to change course after a CSX freight train hit a vehicle left on the tracks in South Carolina.

Thrown off its route, the Amtrak train experienced “significant delays” and was stopped in Denmark, South Carolina, awaiting the arrival of a new crew, Amtrak told ABC News.

“The train was detoured off its normal route in order to continue operating south,” Amtrak said.

Despite Amtrak claiming to have provided ample updates, concerned passengers were apparently calling 911 from the train when it was stuck in rural South Carolina, according to videos taken aboard the train.

“For those of you that are calling the police, we are not holding you hostage,” a conductor said over the loudspeaker. “We are giving you all the information in which we have. We are sorry about the inconvenience.”

The conductor also apparently asked passengers not to open their windows and smoke on the train.

“For those of you that are calling the police, we are not holding you hostage,” a conductor said over the loudspeaker. “We are giving you all the information in which we have. We are sorry about the inconvenience.”

The conductor also apparently asked passengers not to open their windows and smoke on the train.

“For those of you that are calling the police, we are not holding you hostage,” a conductor said over the loudspeaker. “We are giving you all the information in which we have. We are sorry about the inconvenience.”

The conductor also apparently asked passengers not to open their windows and smoke on the train.

“For those of you that are calling the police, we are not holding you hostage,” a conductor said over the loudspeaker. “We are giving you all the information in which we have. We are sorry about the inconvenience.”

The conductor also apparently asked passengers not to open their windows and smoke on the train.
“For those of you that are calling the police, we are not holding you hostage,” a conductor said over the loudspeaker. “We are giving you all the information in which we have. We are sorry about the inconvenience.”

The conductor also apparently asked passengers not to open their windows and smoke on the train.

After nearly 20 hours of delays, the 563 passengers and 333 vehicles were able to disembark Wednesday morning after the train pulled into the station in Sanford, Fla., concluding the 37-hour saga.

In a statement, Amtrak said it had given “regular updates to customers, along with meals, snack packs and beverages.”

The train’s staff also worked with pet owners to provide “bathroom breaks,” the statement said.
Habebe
Member
Wed Jan 11 18:59:30
If I was forced to stay on Amtrak stranded for 37 hours I'd be terrified too, this place sucks.

Cheap Tickets though. Florence to Philly this coming tuesday $87.

The sleeper cars look cool, but way too expensive for what you get.
Rugian
Member
Wed Jan 11 19:07:53
I had to look up where Denmark is. That is pure Deliverance country out there.

(Almost as bad as Florence...no offense)
Habebe
Member
Wed Jan 11 20:18:54
None taken, I live surrounded by swampy rednecks.

The savung Grace is they are all Trumpers and I don't have many neighbors.

I never met lacey, supposedly she was a slutty stripper, but her place has been overgrown for a while, now they are converting it to a bunch of mini homes to make a temporary village of nurses.

Hopefully they look and act like slutty strippers.
obaminated
Member
Wed Jan 11 21:39:49
That would be such a shitty 2 days.
TheChildren
Member
Wed Jan 11 23:55:13
"Trains suck "

>> yes! yankee trains suck donkey balls hard

yankee trains, 100 years behind times!

murder
Member
Thu Jan 12 00:28:03

They didn't believe they were being held hostage, they just wanted to get out of South Carolina and had no other recourse. Getting off the train would have just exposed them to even more South Carolina. :o)

murder
Member
Thu Jan 12 00:28:49

But yes, trains should be reserved for freight and chinamen.

Seb
Member
Thu Jan 12 01:02:49
You are doing trains wrong.
Paramount
Member
Thu Jan 12 01:59:01
Wasn’t any of the passengers armed? They could have arrested the train driver and continued on to the nearest police station and drop him off there.
Paramount
Member
Thu Jan 12 03:17:38
Fox News says air travel is a disaster

http://youtu.be/_Iw-_Y9oKn8


Does anything work in the US? The trillions dollar aid to Ukraine and Israel seems to be the only thing that is working.
Paramount
Member
Thu Jan 12 03:36:58
Fox News says your life is getting worse.

http://youtu.be/TFYbFaVTrog


Train sucks. Air travel sucks. Life sucks.
Rugian
Member
Thu Jan 12 05:50:22
Seb would prefer we do things more like the UK.

"UK Train Stoppages Continue as Threat Grows of Wider Strikes"

http://www...hreat-grows-of-broader-strikes
Seb
Member
Thu Jan 12 05:55:15
Rugian: you literally just had a blanket shut down of US airspace due to under investment.
Rugian
Member
Thu Jan 12 06:17:11
I agree that we need to be investing more in air and road travel.

Trains are just shit. If you're going long distances, you can just take a plane instead for a much shorter trip. If you're commuting to work, chances are you need to drive to the train station, and if you're doing that you may as well drive to work instead.

Good (emphasis on that word) subway systems have their uses in dense cities, but otherwise we should divest from passenger rail.
Seb
Member
Thu Jan 12 07:04:20
Rugian:

" If you're going long distances, you can just take a plane instead for a much shorter trip."

Firstly, it's often not shorter door to door. If your high speed rail doesn't drop you into a well connected station in the centre of town, you are doing it wrong.

Secondly, you only think trains are shit because *your* trains are shit.

Thirdly, on commuting, if you need to drive to get to a station, you are doing it wrong.

murder
Member
Thu Jan 12 09:23:12

No, trains are shit. Trains are a point to point service, and they do it less well and are less versatile that air travel over long distances.

Over shorter distances cars are generally better because again, you can go wherever the hell you want rather than where whoever designed the system decided you needed to go.

And I say that as a resident of a state that could really use high speed rail (and we voted for it) because we're mostly a long skinny peninsula.

For most of the US, passenger rail makes absolutely no sense.

Sam Adams
Member
Thu Jan 12 09:23:56
Trains completely suck. Even euro trains completely suck. the so called "high speed" trains, even between major cities, suck. We are doing a euro trip in march and its amazing how fucking slow these are. Its rare for the average trip speed to exceed 60 mph. Even the largest city pairs. And then to get where you are actually going requires connections, walking, etc. And only for very specific times of course. Just a shitty setup. A car can connect any 2 points, leaving whenever you want, much faster for 99.9% of intended routes.

As cars begin to drive themselves in the next few years, the very last reason to take a train will be gone.

Any civilized network should be purely air and cars. Trains are in the trashbin of history already, and will be extra useless shortly.
Daemon
Member
Thu Jan 12 09:31:13
"Fox News says"
Why do you watch Fox?
patom
Member
Thu Jan 12 09:41:33
The US rail bed system has been in a steady decline for the last 60 years. Much of the rail bed here in Maine will only allow trains to move at less than 30 mph.
Sam Adams
Member
Thu Jan 12 09:48:19
Donkey tracks along canals and horse stables also fell into disuse.
patom
Member
Thu Jan 12 10:31:45
In a way the RR barons brought about their own demise. They used to control just about all industry a hundred years ago.
If you wanted to engage in any business that required freight movement you had to buy your land from the RR's, pay for a siding, and depend on the RR's to move your freight.
With the advent of the Interstate Highway system and modern highway trucks, they were able to bypass the onerous price gouging that RR's imposed on everyone.
Companies no longer had to build and maintain huge ware houses and stockpile material so they didn't run out in production. With Trucking they could operate on an ontime basis.
Paramount
Member
Thu Jan 12 11:05:55
” Why do you watch Fox?”


I don’t. But I watched these two clips. And maybe I have watched a few more over the years. Sometimes it is good to listen to all sides of the political spectrum.
Habebe
Member
Thu Jan 12 11:32:06
"Sometimes it is good to listen to all sides of the political spectrum."

I think this is a healthy attitude.I even enjoy watching the same story as told by different news and from different nations.

India/Al Jazeera have surprised me with their journalism in recent years.
Habebe
Member
Thu Jan 12 11:32:55
Plus I love coffee colored skin tone on females, #Team Princess Jasmin.
Sam Adams
Member
Thu Jan 12 11:51:17
Its pretty tough for trains to compete with the freedom of cars and speed of planes. Its just not a technology thats meant to stick around in the modern age.
Habebe
Member
Thu Jan 12 11:55:15
Sam, While you are here, what's the deal with the plane traffic nonsense? I seen it on the news but didn't really pay attention, I know that's in your realm familiarity.
Sam Adams
Member
Thu Jan 12 12:08:02
Well there were a few cases.

The most egregious by far was southwest. Winter storms disrupted their schedule, and their idiotic scheduling department couldnt put the pieces back together. Planes and pilots were out of position and they just couldn't figure it out. They cancelled something like 20,000 flights and were fucked for about a week.

Winter storms cancel flights, but all the other airliners recover rapidly.

Then yesterday morning an FAA database for pilot alerts got corrupted, they recovered it but it took a few hours. Fairly minor disruption overall.
Seb
Member
Thu Jan 12 12:14:13
Sam:

"Its rare for the average trip speed to exceed 60 mp"

Bullshit.

Which high speed route are you claiming that for?
Sam Adams
Member
Thu Jan 12 12:27:50
"Which high speed route are you claiming that for?"

You know just minor cities like munich to frankfurt, munich to Vienna, geneva to zurich, rome, etc. The only train i found that seems modern was your london to paris chunnel one, with an everage trip speed of some 90-100mph. Frankfurt to munich was next at around 70mph(about the same as the pathetic US acela line from boston to NY). All the others even slower.

Your "high speed" rail is extremely unimpressive.
Sam Adams
Member
Thu Jan 12 12:32:43
Its bad enough we might just rent a car.
Seb
Member
Thu Jan 12 14:00:25
So, mostly the German run lines then?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-speed_rail_in_Germany

Germany has not really invested in lines. They have fast trains, but they haven't upgraded signals or straightened the lines so you end up toddling along at much lower speeds.

Compare to say, Paris to Lyon, 400km in under two hours. *that* is high speed rail. Not sitting in a high speed rail train wombling along a winding track.

A flight for that journey would take 1 hour, but add half hour boarding and the fact you need to get into the city centre from the airport - far faster by train. And much more comfortable.
Seb
Member
Thu Jan 12 14:00:25
So, mostly the German run lines then?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-speed_rail_in_Germany

Germany has not really invested in lines. They have fast trains, but they haven't upgraded signals or straightened the lines so you end up toddling along at much lower speeds.

Compare to say, Paris to Lyon, 400km in under two hours. *that* is high speed rail. Not sitting in a high speed rail train wombling along a winding track.

A flight for that journey would take 1 hour, but add half hour boarding and the fact you need to get into the city centre from the airport - far faster by train. And much more comfortable.
Habebe
Member
Thu Jan 12 14:13:55
http://youtu.be/wILpl5IfGTU

Here is tge video, watching it now.


PS: I'm watching it in the rain with no speed issues, no waits since Ive switched to T-monile home internet over sayelite.
obaminated
Member
Thu Jan 12 14:38:38
Krystal Ball is a hot piece of ass. BP is okay but it wouldn't be successful if it didn't have her as eye candy.
Sam Adams
Member
Thu Jan 12 16:51:28
"400km". No one is suggesting you fly 400km unless you are island hopping. Thats clearly car distance. Unless you are going from city center to city center, a car smokes rail.

Cars below about 600km, planes above 800km. Theres some grey area where they meet. There is no distance in which trains can compete.
patom
Member
Thu Jan 12 17:24:14
Trains or planes for transportation vs cars. It depends on where you are where you are going and how much time you have to spend there.

For instance I live in the Bangor Maine area and can be on I-95 within 10 min. If I time it right I can drive to Philadelphia in about 8 hrs.
If I fly I can be at the Bangor airport in 15 min. I still have to be there 2 hours before my flight. If I get a direct flight to Philly then I have to wait for my luggage. Find a rental car agency rent a car. drive from the airport to Bucks County on the north side of Philly. Best case scenario is 4 to 5 hour trip. Cost driving would be a couple of tanks of gas and a few tolls. Flying and renting a car would be about double. or more. All I gain from flying would be about 3 hrs.
If I took the train I still have to drive to Brunswick Me. to the northern most AMTRAK station, about 1.45 hrs. Still have to rent a car or take public trans from center city Philly, and have no wheels. Have to rent a car or depend on friends to taxi me around.
obaminated
Member
Thu Jan 12 17:51:34
Do you actually need to be there 2 hours early? I imagine an airport in Maine to be roughly the size of long Beach Airport or john Wayne and I've found showing up 30 minutes before the flight gives me 10 minutes to sit and wait before boarding. Bigger airports like LAX do require you to be there at least an hour early (assuming it isn't holiday season) and that's because it is big and it takes time to get to your terminal.
Sam Adams
Member
Thu Jan 12 19:22:02
Security and all that is indeed a hassle. Thats why most people will probably drive up to about 8 hours... even if flying is a few hours faster.
Sam Adams
Member
Thu Jan 12 19:23:48
Same with trains of course... still a hassle. Except trains will almost never be faster, so while planes eventually take over as distance increases, trains always lose.
Habebe
Member
Thu Jan 12 19:26:16
"Krystal Ball is a hot piece of ass. BP is okay but it wouldn't be successful if it didn't have her as eye candy."

Yeah she aged well.
Seb
Member
Fri Jan 13 01:37:21
What sort of an idiot wants to drive 400km over c. 4 hours when they can take a train in under 2, and do something productive or useful on the route?

This idea that you need a car at the other end - that's what local bus, comutsr rail or taxis are for.
patom
Member
Fri Jan 13 06:11:47
Seb, with my car I can go when I want, when I want, where I want, without having to rely on someone else's schedule. Not saying that trains and other public modes of transport are not ever used. Just that in some instances and depending what my agenda is at the end of a trip. You might prefer to have the means to get around on your own.

If I lived in NY City or London. I would probably not own a car. In fact NY has the fewest number of licensed drivers per capita in the US. Even those with licenses, many of them don't own a car. Just too damned expensive. Parking, insurance etc. are rediculous there.
TheChildren
Member
Fri Jan 13 06:52:47
yes!

ur trains are suck fungus covered rotten decayin food hard

reality check gettin through ur thick skulls yet

it aint even good enough for street rats haha




murder
Member
Fri Jan 13 06:56:44

"This idea that you need a car at the other end - that's what local bus, comutsr rail or taxis are for."

No, local buses are for avoiding. There is likely no commuter rail and that's generally for avoiding too. And Uber is less convenient and more expensive than having your own car with you.

The only way local buses would ever be usable (if you can avoid them) would be to reduce capacity and widen them ... which would mean having to widen every street. The only thing worse than being trapped in a box with 50 strangers is being packed in with people invading your space. If I'm going to get to know someone that well, I'd like to choose who it is.



Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Fri Jan 13 06:59:38
Seb
“This idea that you need a car at the other end - that's what local bus, comutsr rail or taxis are for.“

Cars are more convenient, door to door, no transit of luggage, no waiting, hoping you get seats and the AC is working well enough, seats are clean enough that you actually want to sit. And should you be traveling with small children, all of this is even more true.
Seb
Member
Fri Jan 13 07:34:40
Murder:

"No, local buses are for avoiding. There is likely no commuter rail and that's generally for avoiding too. "

This is my point: you guys do trains and indeed public transport wrong. If your high speed train is landing into a terminus without good pubic transport links then something has gone wrong.

If I am travelling to rural France, or somewhere where I will be self catering for more than three days I drive.

If I am travelling to a city for a few days (less than a week) it is rail or air or a mix. E.g. to Griefswald, plane to berlin then train. Lund, another one: plane to Copenhagen and train.

If I am travelling for work for a day or two, it is almost always rail.

And I think that would probably be true in the US *if you had effective public transport systems*. It is not that the mode of transport is useless, it is that the US hasn't implemented it or has implemented it half heartedly.

Nim:
"And should you be traveling with small children, all of this is even more true."

Yes. I personally love stopping every hour or so to give them toilet breaks or recover from car sickness.

Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Fri Jan 13 09:47:09
You can get motion sick in buses or cabs and trains or really anything that is moving. The toilet breaks every hour does not make sense, are they drinking all the time?

These are comedy movie issues, not real world issues.
Sam Adams
Member
Fri Jan 13 09:50:54
"What sort of an idiot wants to drive 400km over c. 4 hours when they can take a train in under 2"

Except there are almost 0 location pairs connected by a train that fast. Even where such a train exists, very few places, what are the odds you have both your spots at the stations? So now, factor in connections, showing up early so you dont miss the train, now your "high speed" trip is car speed, probably even slower. At least planes have such a crazy high speed that they will eventually pass the freedom of cars with pure power. Trains never make up for their lack of convenience with speed.

Asking a train network to match cars is a fools errand.

"and do something productive or useful"

This, the only advantage trains ever had, is about to go away.
patom
Member
Fri Jan 13 09:57:52
Seb, I personally will never live by choice in any city. The closest house to me is about 500 feet away and I can't see it for the trees. I would have to walk about 4 miles to the nearest public bus route. It's not that I don't like people, it's that I don't like living in that close a proximity to them. Now I'm betting that you live in a row house or if its a single unit you don't have more than an alleyway separating you from your neighbor. I've lived here in Maine for the last 37 years and every time I visit where I grew up, in about 2 days my skin is crawling at me to get the hell out of there.
Habebe
Member
Fri Jan 13 10:43:40
"Except there are almost 0 location pairs connected by a train that fast."

Plus you need to rent a car when you get there anyway.

Ans you have to deal with train people.

I like the train occasionally.

1. When I lived in Philly I did take the L and the local busses daily, having a car in Philly is a hassle, but taking a trip back to the burbs is an all day event instead of a 30-40 minute drive.

2. Up and back to PA sometimes*, the plane is more suspicious of illegal substances and its a long trip, Ive made the trip in 8 hours driving, but I was speeding my ass off and was driving at about 130 MPH on the turnpike. For $87 its nice to nap for a while and isnt much longer than a normal drive at about 11 hours.
Sam Adams
Member
Fri Jan 13 10:44:07
Humans seem to be a mix of small pack hunters who dont like too many other humans around, and herd followers like seb who just like to follow the crowd and live in cities.

Interesting.

But even in cities, their size and thus necessity of connecting multiple trains and walking makes the network suck. Fixed tracks and routes just cant be made convenient except for a few "lucky" herd followers that happen to live and work near major train stops and also dont want to explore beyond their city much.
Sam Adams
Member
Fri Jan 13 10:48:39
"you have to deal with train people."

I do love that the kind of person that hypes trains generally suports policy that fills light rail and busses with homeless zombies and criminals, discouraging trains from ever being used.

At least the longer intercity trains should be expensive enough to keep the junkies away.
obaminated
Member
Fri Jan 13 10:53:23
I wish more people were like seb. Taking trains and public transportation, stay off the road, please and thank you.
Sam Adams
Member
Fri Jan 13 10:57:06
Lol good point. Trains are awesome. Skiing sucks. Stay in cities. Dont come up here.
Dukhat
Member
Fri Jan 13 10:58:11
Have the displeasure of being in a red-state city right now. No fucking mass transit at all. Everything is 2-lane roadways filled with dumbasses in trucks and suv's.

And you get distracted by articles about trains, which you never ever take anyways. Retarded as fuck.

obaminated
Member
Fri Jan 13 11:12:58
Lol. The self proclaimed billionaire lives in the sticks.
Sam Adams
Member
Fri Jan 13 11:21:01
Cities just suck. Getting around cities sucks via car or train.

But if you come up here you might die in an avalanche so you should probably stay in your cities.
Dukhat
Member
Fri Jan 13 11:34:39
Getting around cities by subway is fine. Barcelona's is really very clean. Bangkok's clean as well. Walkable cities are amazing.

I also love taking my motorbike in safe cities. I never do it in red states though and red areas. Too many assholes in trucks think I'm somehow wronging them and might push me off the road.
obaminated
Member
Fri Jan 13 11:40:48
I doubt that ever happens. I do believe you own a cheap bike you peddle around in.
Sam Adams
Member
Fri Jan 13 11:41:46
"Getting around cities by subway is fine."

Lol no. Once or twice when visiting sure but if you have to routinely rely on the fucking things your life blows.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Fri Jan 13 12:57:21
Judging by Dukhat’s previous lies, I would bet that he is talking about an ordinary bike, it’s not even a moped or one of WTB’s gay electric scooters.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Fri Jan 13 13:00:17
Public transport is a great idea, but too many people have access. If you even bother to pay or if the pass is ‘t given to you from social services or school. I have almost killed people on public transport. Arguably I have almost killed people in a car, but those people were outside the car :-)
patom
Member
Fri Jan 13 13:59:11
Nim, does that mean your driving skills leave a lot to be desired?
patom
Member
Fri Jan 13 14:03:57
Actually, in this day and age, you are taking a huge risk walking or biking. With all these asshats that can't seem to function unless they are in constant communication with the world via their cell phones. They are distracted almost all the time. Plus the number of dummies that want to either wear camo or black clothing and go walking, at night.
I agree that I would love to see most people using mass transit. Most of them suck behind the wheel.
Habebe
Member
Fri Jan 13 14:59:09
"At least the longer intercity trains should be expensive enough to keep the junkies away."

Yeah, the L was loaded with them, Amtrak wasn't but I also taake a 660 mile trip one way. From DC north its a much better ride, all electric, from DC south its diesel.

"one of WTB’s gay electric scooters."

Hahahahahahaha, because of course he does.
Seb
Member
Fri Jan 13 16:27:56
Sam:

"Except there are almost 0 location pairs connected by a train that fast"

There are in countries that bother to build them.

This is like saying planes are rubbish when you are going to somewhere without an airport.

"? So now, factor in connections, showing up early so you dont miss the train,"

This isn't a thing.

"Trains never make up for their lack of convenience with speed."

Like I said, what's convenient about having to drive a vehicle for longer Vs doing something else?

"This, the only advantage trains ever had, is about to go away."

I think that's highly optimistic read of the state of the technology.

Patom:

"I personally will never live by choice in any city."

Great, but that makes you part of the 17% of the population of the US that isn't living in an urban area.

Habebe:

"Plus you need to rent a car when you get there anyway"

No. If you need to rent a car when you get there, you drive in the first place. Mostly, your don't need to, because in sensible countries with first world transit systems, high speed rail connects to areas with functioning public transport.

Sam:

"also dont want to explore beyond their city much."

I mean, I know you love the snark, but the whole point about high speed trains is they carry a lot more people than plane routes can - so who are all the passengers on these trains if all these people living in cities don't like to explore beyond their city?

"homeless zombies and criminals"
Sounds like someone who is affraid of exploring and fears other people would say.

Habebe:

"Yeah, the L was loaded with them"

That just means that not only do you do public transport wrong in the US, you also do drugs and social policy wrong also.

A

Habebe
Member
Fri Jan 13 17:31:20
"No. If you need to rent a car when you get there, you drive in the first place. Mostly, your don't need to, because in sensible countries with first world transit systems, high speed rail connects to areas with functioning public transport."


1. You live in a tiny nation.
2. Even then you are limited where you can go, Americans don't enjoy having to take multiple forms of transportation if they decide to go outside a city center for example.We are a little spoiled that way I suppose.
Habebe
Member
Fri Jan 13 17:32:40
"That just means that not only do you do public transport wrong in the US, you also do drugs and social policy wrong also."

We agree on this.
Habebe
Member
Fri Jan 13 17:47:34
Seb, Id be curious on your take ofnhow much blame lands on the feet of Mayor Pete?

This isn't his first big fuck up since becoming the transportation secretary.
Sam Adams
Member
Fri Jan 13 22:50:06
"but the whole point about high speed trains is they carry a lot more people than plane routes can"

Thats not the point at all. The point is their inconvenience and slow speed. They only connect city centers and being limited to wheels on earths surface, are almost always at least 5x slower than planes. Only people going between nearby city centers should ever use them. planes are also limited to inconvinient points but at least make up for that after a while with shear speed, something a train cant do.

AND once you reach a certain capacity further capacity doesnt make any more money. a huge capacity doesnt help. you make money with frequency and efficiency in this industry. why do you think the giant A380 was put out of business so rapidly? While the much smaller A320 and 737 are the backbone of the travel industry? The 737 is older than we are by a lot.
Sam Adams
Member
Fri Jan 13 22:54:24
"I think that's highly optimistic read of the state of the technology"

Its coming within the investment timescale. 1 year? Sure not yet. 5 years? 10 years almost certainly.

Youd be a clown to invest in trains right now.
jergul
large member
Sat Jan 14 01:37:12
Sammy
Subsidies. Lobbyists got governments to fund airport expansions for more slots instead of adapting to use existing slots better.

A380s did catch on in highly rational countries.

"why do you think the giant A380 was put out of business so rapidly? While the much smaller A320 and 737 are the backbone of the travel industry?"
Seb
Member
Sat Jan 14 02:14:03
Habebe:

"1. You live in a tiny nation."

And? Oh. Yes. You are used to the idea that people don't travel outside their borders frequently.

"2. Even then you are limited where you can go"
What?

" Americans don't enjoy having to take multiple forms of transportation if they decide to go outside a city center for example."

Americans, bluntly, wouldn't know because they don't have the option. However, it's worth noting that every American that settles in Europe usually finds effective public transport and healthcare one of the improvements.

"We are a little spoiled that way I suppose."
No. Stockholm syndrome.

"They only connect city centers"
And that's why you have public transport systems.

"5 years? 10 years almost certainly."

Doubtful. It's becoming increasingly clear that the limitations of the existing AI being used aren't reliable and refillable, explainable and assurable enough to actually transferring legal responsibility from the driver to the car manufacturer. Which means you will still need to have your hands on the wheel.

In any case, the market is going the other direction: as cars become more computers on wheels, the more car manufacturers are going to move capabilities your car has from capital purchase to rental. Fully self driving is the point they would likely stop selling cars and maximise profit per unit by forcing you to rent them instead.
Seb
Member
Sat Jan 14 02:15:05
"reliable and refillable,"

God I hate autocorrect. Where the fuck did "and refillable" come from?
Sam Adams
Member
Sat Jan 14 11:42:51
"A380s did catch on in highly rational countries."

No. The A380 is clearly too big for the market.

And its a shitty design too. Too short and stubby for its size. Not as efficient as it should have been because airbus put in the extra width and strength for easy future stretches(despite the plane being already too big). Just a bad play.

The project was canceled early and most planes are being scrapped early.

Meanwhile the more appropriately sized and better 777-300ER 787 and A350 are and were selling rapidly during the same period.

Also note that the mighty 747, the best airliner ever made but always a little larger than ideal, was retired during the same timeframe.

Moderate sized flexibility beats shear size. Its why the 787 smoked the a380 and why the car beats the train.
Sam Adams
Member
Sat Jan 14 11:44:46
"And that's why you have public transport systems."

No. Thats why you have cars. Connections suck.
Sam Adams
Member
Sat Jan 14 11:58:34
I should add the 747 was retired from passenger service. The old bird still has plenty of life left as a freighter. The shitty A380 cant even carry freight well, as airbus could never figure out how to hold much weight on the upper floor.
Habebe
Member
Sat Jan 14 13:05:11
Sebs answer is to settle for 2nd rate travel.
Forwyn
Member
Sat Jan 14 15:07:47
A quick google search says Denmark to Orlando is 366mi.

Walk off the train and get a rental car and drive 6 hours, call after and comp the train ticket lol
Forwyn
Member
Sat Jan 14 15:09:37
"The Auto Train left Virginia at 5 p.m. Monday and was supposed to reach Orlando, Fla. by 10 a.m. Tuesday"

Lol maybe people would take Seb's trains more if they actually went at Seb's train pace instead of taking 17 hours to make an 11 hour car trip
Habebe
Member
Sat Jan 14 15:19:43
Trains have a place and purpose, But they are just subbpar to a car, largely because they can only go where there is track.
murder
Member
Sat Jan 14 19:02:37

"The 737 is older than we are by a lot."

Nope.

murder
Member
Sat Jan 14 19:12:33

"Americans, bluntly, wouldn't know because they don't have the option. However, it's worth noting that every American that settles in Europe usually finds effective public transport and healthcare one of the improvements."

Americans that relocate to Europe tend to be of a certain type. Europe mostly appeals to those people before they ever get there.

murder
Member
Sat Jan 14 20:27:48

Just for LazyCommunist ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubYNpa9QHX8

It's about the Triumph of the Moscow Underground if anyone else want to view it.

Sam Adams
Member
Sat Jan 14 21:25:00
"The 737 is older than we are by a lot."

Nope."

I was talking to seb. I dont actually know how old seb is so that was a bit of a guess but i doubt hes 737 age.
Habebe
Member
Sat Jan 14 21:47:35
I think Seb is early 40s. So a little older than I am.
patom
Member
Sun Jan 15 06:00:58
In any case, it all depends on where you are going or coming from, how much time you have and available transportation options at either end of your trip.

In actuality there are probably millions who use trains daily in the US. Every day there are thousands that live in Bucks County Pa that drive to Trenton NJ take the train to NYC for work. That is just one line. There are a bunch of commuter trains radiating in to NYC from the outlying areas of NY, Connecticut, New Jersey, PA.. Once in NY there are all sorts of bus, subway, taxi services available. In fact NYC has the fewest per capita licensed drivers in the USA. It cost too much to keep a car in NYC. $500 a month to park. Rediculous Insurance rates.
williamthebastard
Member
Sun Jan 15 06:36:20
"Americans that relocate to Europe tend to be of a certain type. Europe mostly appeals to those people before they ever get there."

Perhaps. One of my best friends, Charles, comes from a rich Trumpian Maryland family, married and settled down in Sweden with kids. Getting some distance to the USA has changed his views so radically that he says now he can't ever go back.
williamthebastard
Member
Sun Jan 15 06:37:58
And one of the things he loves is that he doesnt need a car anymore (his father makes hot rods for stars, so brought up in a car and gun loving family). He's turned into a bicycle nut now and collects expensive bikes.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Sun Jan 15 06:41:18
Very interesting and tellinf that WTB has a friend to personify every political issue into one of good and evil. True or not (he is most likely making alot of it up), it says something about the very personal cosmic battle he thinks he is fighting.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Sun Jan 15 06:43:20
Of course Charles has a bike, he also recently discovered that soy hot dogs are awesome, he can’t tell the difference with real meat!
obaminated
Member
Sun Jan 15 08:35:03
Once charles got to Europe he completely disassociated himself from trumpian beliefs. He is now a solid a firm socialist.
Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Sun Jan 15 08:47:06
And he gets along great with his wife’s lover.
Seb
Member
Sun Jan 15 13:55:44
Habebe:

"Sebs answer is to settle for 2nd rate travel."

It's first rate. You, as in so many things, settle for less and convince yourself it is better.

Patom:

"In actuality there are probably millions who use trains daily in the US."

So, think about how many more might use them if you actually had functioning mass transit systems and high speed rail.

Nim:

More telling that you find the idea of having friends on both sides of the spectrum odd. I suspect if you did, you might not have become so radicalised.

Nimatzo
iChihuaha
Sun Jan 15 15:09:54
Seb
You are incoherent. I don’t think anything is ”odd” or out of place. It is infact predictable. You are an incompetent reader.
murder
Member
Sun Jan 15 15:42:53

"So, think about how many more might use them if you actually had functioning mass transit systems and high speed rail."

Most don't use it because they want to. They use it because they have no choice.

Habebe
Member
Sun Jan 15 16:05:40
"It's first rate. You, as in so many things, settle for less and convince yourself it is better."

Please explain how a train is a better form of travel to an automobile which doesn't need a track nor does it need to be shared with strangers.
Habebe
Member
Sun Jan 15 16:08:53
Also WTB's "friends" ...lol.

They are men he has sex with and they collect bicycles and antiques.
murder
Member
Sun Jan 15 16:58:47

You Can Get $200 Off Amtrak's Rail Pass Right Now
Avoid chaotic airports and see the country by train in 2023.

http://lif...rail-pass-right-now-1849977980

Sam Adams
Member
Sun Jan 15 16:59:26
Trains are for 19th century weenies. Nuff said.
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