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Utopia Talk / Politics / Not a Muslim but...

Daemon
Member Fri Mar 10 08:38:25
... damaged by religion nevertheless

http://www...hall-hamburg-jehovahs-witness/

6 killed in shooting at Hamburg, Germany, Jehovah's Witness hall, including an unborn child, police say

Updated on: March 10, 2023 / 9:31 AM / CBS/AP

A gunman killed six people Thursday night at a Jehovah's Witnesses hall in the German city of Hamburg before apparently turning his gun on himself. The shooter was identified as a former member of the congregation, police said Friday. Four men, one woman and an unborn child were killed. Police initially said Friday that a pregnant woman had died in the attack, but they later confirmed she survived but her 7-month-old fetus did not.

Police identified the gunman on Friday as unmarried former church member Phillip F., and said there was no indication of a terrorist motive.

Police had told CBS News previously that the shooter was inside the building the entire time and there was no manhunt at any point. When officers arrived, the shooter had already died by suicide.

The police did not give any indication of a suspected motive as they briefed journalists Friday morning about the shooting that stunned Germany's second-biggest city.

German magazine Der Spiegel first reported that the suspect was "said to have been a former member of Jehovah's Witnesses... between 30 and 40 years old."

Police confirmed Friday that the gunman used a semi-automatic pistol that he was licensed to own. They said there was an anonymous letter sent to the police force several years ago claiming the suspect was mentally unstable and had shown animosity for religious followers, and that a review of his firearms licensing was carried out.

They said when questioned, Phillip F. was cooperative and gave no indication of any mental health problems, so they closed the case. He was a sports marksman.

Mass shootings are rare in Europe, where gun ownership laws are generally much stricter than in many U.S. states. There is a long and strict process in Germany to obtain a permit for a handgun.

German Chancellor Olaf Scholz, a former Hamburg mayor, described the shooting as "a brutal act of violence."

Investigators worked through the night to secure evidence. On Friday morning, forensic investigators in protective white suits could still be seen outside the building as a light snow fell. Officers placed yellow cones on the ground and windowsills to mark evidence.

David Semonian, a U.S.-based spokesman for Jehovah's Witnesses, told The Associated Press in an emailed statement early Friday that members "worldwide grieve for the victims of this traumatic event."

"The congregation elders in the local area are providing pastoral care for those affected by the event," he wrote. "We understand that the authorities are still investigating the details of this crime. We appreciate the courageous help provided by the police and emergency services."

Hamburg Mayor Peter Tschentscher tweeted that the news was "shocking" and offered his sympathy to the victims' relatives.

The scene of the shooting was the Jehovah's Witnesses' Kingdom Hall, a modern and boxy three-story building next to an auto repair shop.

Police spokesman Holger Vehren said police were alerted to the shooting about 9:15 p.m. and were on the scene quickly. On Friday morning, police confirmed they had received almost 50 emergency calls about the shooting.

Vehren said after officers arrived and found people with apparent gunshot wounds on the ground floor, they heard a shot from an upper floor and found a fatally wounded person upstairs who they suspected was a shooter. He said police did not have to use their firearms.

Student Laura Bauch, who lives nearby, said "there were about four periods of shooting," German news agency dpa reported. "There were always several shots in these periods, roughly at intervals of 20 seconds to a minute," she said.

Jehovah's Witnesses are part of an international church, founded in the United States in the 19th century and headquartered in Warwick, New York. It claims a worldwide membership of about 8.7 million, with about 170,000 in Germany.

Members are known for their evangelistic efforts that include knocking on doors and distributing literature in public squares. The denomination's distinctive practices include a refusal to bear arms, receive blood transfusions, salute a national flag or participate in secular government.

murder
Member Fri Mar 10 08:52:07

"A gunman killed six people Thursday night at a Jehovah's Witnesses ..."

They should have quit knocking on his fucking door. :o)

murder
Member Fri Mar 10 08:55:14

"Jehovah's Witnesses are part of an international church, founded in the United States in the 19th century and headquartered in Warwick, New York. It claims a worldwide membership of about 8.7 million, with about 170,000 in Germany."

There have to be more than that. I've had to run off at least that many over the years.

Daemon
Member Fri Mar 10 13:14:08
Translated automatically

http://www...-christlichen-extremismus.html

Before he set off to kill, the Hamburg spree killer posted a reference to his book. It is the work of a Christian extremist, experts say.

He praised Hitler and Putin. He even considered Hitler an instrument of Christ for his 1,000-year empire. And he declared the Corona pandemic a judgment of God. Philipp F., the man who shot wildly and killed eight people in a Jehovah's Witness Kingdom Hall in Hamburg, left behind a crude body of work. It says a lot about the 35-year-old's thinking.

The book was so important to the man that he dedicated his last message to it: 100 per cent satisfaction rate sales, he wrote on a network early Thursday evening. Perpetrators often want to leave a message, media do them a favour if they go too much into it. That is why t-online limits itself to a few statements.

F. was considered a charismatic personality, the book testifies to a big ego or delusions of grandeur. Philipp F. considers it an epoch-making work that is compulsory reading for leaders and various sciences. It is translated into Portuguese, Spanish, French, Arabic and Mandarin. It is "The Truth about God, Jesus Christ and Satan" and the first attempt to make visible their influences on humanity, society and the individual. It also promises to reveal "the secret of Christ's 1,000-year kingdom".

If one looks for it in the book, Adolf Hitler is described there as a human instrument of Jesus Christ. Hitler had his idea of a "thousand-year kingdom" from Jesus and wanted to implement it for him. The persecution of the Jews was an "act of heaven".

Elsewhere, he benevolently names Hitler and Putin in common: both had or would have God's favour. Putin was also one of the few statesmen who publicly stood up for God's values.

For Jehovah's Witnesses, this must be a slap in the face. "I can imagine that something like that is completely unacceptable there and must lead to conflict," says Islamic scholar Lamya Kaddor, spokeswoman on domestic and religious policy for the Green Party. "He writes that Putin is under God's protection, while at the same time Jehovah's Witnesses complain that the community is persecuted there." However, his ideology ties in with Jehovah's Witness positions elsewhere with the idea of a 1,000-year kingdom after the return of Christ.

But was the attitude therein perhaps the reason why Philipp F. broke with Jehovah's Witnesses in Hamburg? There is still no clarity as to why F. informed the congregation of his departure in a letter. Tsfidaris could not say anything about that on Friday either. "We also have other worries right now. We are taking care of relatives and families who have been torn apart by the terrible act."

murder
Member Fri Mar 10 14:59:50

"He praised Hitler and Putin."

Of course he did.

"If one looks for it in the book, Adolf Hitler is described there as a human instrument of Jesus Christ. Hitler had his idea of a "thousand-year kingdom" from Jesus and wanted to implement it for him. The persecution of the Jews was an "act of heaven"."

It's pretty amazing how often acts of heaven fail miserably. I'm starting to think that maybe God isn't all powerful.

show deleted posts

Daemon Member	Fri Mar 10 08:38:25 ... damaged by religion nevertheless http://www...hall-hamburg-jehovahs-witness/ 6 killed in shooting at Hamburg, Germany, Jehovah's Witness hall, including an unborn child, police say Updated on: March 10, 2023 / 9:31 AM / CBS/AP A gunman killed six people Thursday night at a Jehovah's Witnesses hall in the German city of Hamburg before apparently turning his gun on himself. The shooter was identified as a former member of the congregation, police said Friday. Four men, one woman and an unborn child were killed. Police initially said Friday that a pregnant woman had died in the attack, but they later confirmed she survived but her 7-month-old fetus did not. Police identified the gunman on Friday as unmarried former church member Phillip F., and said there was no indication of a terrorist motive. Police had told CBS News previously that the shooter was inside the building the entire time and there was no manhunt at any point. When officers arrived, the shooter had already died by suicide. The police did not give any indication of a suspected motive as they briefed journalists Friday morning about the shooting that stunned Germany's second-biggest city. German magazine Der Spiegel first reported that the suspect was "said to have been a former member of Jehovah's Witnesses... between 30 and 40 years old." Police confirmed Friday that the gunman used a semi-automatic pistol that he was licensed to own. They said there was an anonymous letter sent to the police force several years ago claiming the suspect was mentally unstable and had shown animosity for religious followers, and that a review of his firearms licensing was carried out. They said when questioned, Phillip F. was cooperative and gave no indication of any mental health problems, so they closed the case. He was a sports marksman. Mass shootings are rare in Europe, where gun ownership laws are generally much stricter than in many U.S. states. There is a long and strict process in Germany to obtain a permit for a handgun. German Chancellor Olaf Scholz, a former Hamburg mayor, described the shooting as "a brutal act of violence." Investigators worked through the night to secure evidence. On Friday morning, forensic investigators in protective white suits could still be seen outside the building as a light snow fell. Officers placed yellow cones on the ground and windowsills to mark evidence. David Semonian, a U.S.-based spokesman for Jehovah's Witnesses, told The Associated Press in an emailed statement early Friday that members "worldwide grieve for the victims of this traumatic event." "The congregation elders in the local area are providing pastoral care for those affected by the event," he wrote. "We understand that the authorities are still investigating the details of this crime. We appreciate the courageous help provided by the police and emergency services." Hamburg Mayor Peter Tschentscher tweeted that the news was "shocking" and offered his sympathy to the victims' relatives. The scene of the shooting was the Jehovah's Witnesses' Kingdom Hall, a modern and boxy three-story building next to an auto repair shop. Police spokesman Holger Vehren said police were alerted to the shooting about 9:15 p.m. and were on the scene quickly. On Friday morning, police confirmed they had received almost 50 emergency calls about the shooting. Vehren said after officers arrived and found people with apparent gunshot wounds on the ground floor, they heard a shot from an upper floor and found a fatally wounded person upstairs who they suspected was a shooter. He said police did not have to use their firearms. Student Laura Bauch, who lives nearby, said "there were about four periods of shooting," German news agency dpa reported. "There were always several shots in these periods, roughly at intervals of 20 seconds to a minute," she said. Jehovah's Witnesses are part of an international church, founded in the United States in the 19th century and headquartered in Warwick, New York. It claims a worldwide membership of about 8.7 million, with about 170,000 in Germany. Members are known for their evangelistic efforts that include knocking on doors and distributing literature in public squares. The denomination's distinctive practices include a refusal to bear arms, receive blood transfusions, salute a national flag or participate in secular government.
murder Member	Fri Mar 10 08:52:07 "A gunman killed six people Thursday night at a Jehovah's Witnesses ..." They should have quit knocking on his fucking door. :o)
murder Member	Fri Mar 10 08:55:14 "Jehovah's Witnesses are part of an international church, founded in the United States in the 19th century and headquartered in Warwick, New York. It claims a worldwide membership of about 8.7 million, with about 170,000 in Germany." There have to be more than that. I've had to run off at least that many over the years.
Daemon Member	Fri Mar 10 13:14:08 Translated automatically http://www...-christlichen-extremismus.html Before he set off to kill, the Hamburg spree killer posted a reference to his book. It is the work of a Christian extremist, experts say. He praised Hitler and Putin. He even considered Hitler an instrument of Christ for his 1,000-year empire. And he declared the Corona pandemic a judgment of God. Philipp F., the man who shot wildly and killed eight people in a Jehovah's Witness Kingdom Hall in Hamburg, left behind a crude body of work. It says a lot about the 35-year-old's thinking. The book was so important to the man that he dedicated his last message to it: 100 per cent satisfaction rate sales, he wrote on a network early Thursday evening. Perpetrators often want to leave a message, media do them a favour if they go too much into it. That is why t-online limits itself to a few statements. F. was considered a charismatic personality, the book testifies to a big ego or delusions of grandeur. Philipp F. considers it an epoch-making work that is compulsory reading for leaders and various sciences. It is translated into Portuguese, Spanish, French, Arabic and Mandarin. It is "The Truth about God, Jesus Christ and Satan" and the first attempt to make visible their influences on humanity, society and the individual. It also promises to reveal "the secret of Christ's 1,000-year kingdom". If one looks for it in the book, Adolf Hitler is described there as a human instrument of Jesus Christ. Hitler had his idea of a "thousand-year kingdom" from Jesus and wanted to implement it for him. The persecution of the Jews was an "act of heaven". Elsewhere, he benevolently names Hitler and Putin in common: both had or would have God's favour. Putin was also one of the few statesmen who publicly stood up for God's values. For Jehovah's Witnesses, this must be a slap in the face. "I can imagine that something like that is completely unacceptable there and must lead to conflict," says Islamic scholar Lamya Kaddor, spokeswoman on domestic and religious policy for the Green Party. "He writes that Putin is under God's protection, while at the same time Jehovah's Witnesses complain that the community is persecuted there." However, his ideology ties in with Jehovah's Witness positions elsewhere with the idea of a 1,000-year kingdom after the return of Christ. But was the attitude therein perhaps the reason why Philipp F. broke with Jehovah's Witnesses in Hamburg? There is still no clarity as to why F. informed the congregation of his departure in a letter. Tsfidaris could not say anything about that on Friday either. "We also have other worries right now. We are taking care of relatives and families who have been torn apart by the terrible act."
murder Member	Fri Mar 10 14:59:50 "He praised Hitler and Putin." Of course he did. "If one looks for it in the book, Adolf Hitler is described there as a human instrument of Jesus Christ. Hitler had his idea of a "thousand-year kingdom" from Jesus and wanted to implement it for him. The persecution of the Jews was an "act of heaven"." It's pretty amazing how often acts of heaven fail miserably. I'm starting to think that maybe God isn't all powerful.
	show deleted posts

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