Utopia Talk / Politics / Classified Documents case vs Trump

murder Member	Mon Jul 15 10:02:46 tumbleweed is having a bad day :o(
murder Member	Mon Jul 15 10:31:22 http://i.imgflip.com/8x2ak8.jpg
Rugian Member	Mon Jul 15 10:41:13 Teflon Don strikes again!
Average Ameriacn Member	Mon Jul 15 10:43:05 Trump keeps on winning!
murder Member	Mon Jul 15 10:53:51 I think I can say with a high degree of uncertainty that Merrick Garland is the most useless and cowardly piece of shit ever appointed Attorney General.
murder Member	Mon Jul 15 10:54:13 high degree of certainty*
tumbleweed the wanderer	Mon Jul 15 11:18:02 i'm sure cultists (& cult leader) have decided this makes Trump innocent
tumbleweed the wanderer	Mon Jul 15 11:31:37 the shitty judge was already delaying the case unnecessarily in holding hearings on tons of dumb shit that she didn't have to hold hearings on (according to multiple legal experts)... incompetence or corruptness was unclear though as she's a novice judge who fucked up other cases too in any case, if not overturned on appeal (as she has been before on this case), hopefully they get a real judge when re-filing the case was never happening before election anyway with this shit judge, so doesn't change much Trump elected = completely corruptly dismissed (& his cult won't care at all) Trump not elected = justice has chance to occur (though w/ a FL jury) Trump took the documents (undisputed), Trump refused to return (undisputed), Trump eventually subpoenaed for the docs for which even his lawyers said he had to comply (undisputed), prior to search Trump spent a week looking through the boxes for some reason (indefensible... undisputed, though he probably would dispute if anyone who he does interviews ever asked, though they wont as all loyal allies), Trump then kept hidden many boxes from his lawyer who then conducted the search & (presumably unwittingly) lied to subpoena a full search of the boxes done (same indefensible/undisputed thing), over 100 classified docs remained after that corrupted subpoena search not recovered til the FBI search warrant ('raid'), at first Trump first floated completely idiotic 'automatic declassification' & 'mental declassification' ideas, but now going with completely confirmably false claim he was allowed to take any doc he wanted cultists/Faux: who cares! yay Trump!
Dukhat Member	Mon Jul 15 12:42:59 Clarence Thomas wrote in the recent presidential immunity case that Aileen Cannon should do this and she did. Our fucking court system has been so corrupted by Republicans.
murder Member	Mon Jul 15 16:10:34 Never fear! I'm sure Merrick Garland is all over this. ;o)
obaminated Member	Mon Jul 15 19:56:31 Man. The past 72 hours have been rough for tw. All but certain trump will win. Biden supporter failed in his attempt, completely giving the moral highground to Trump. Biden can no longer claim trump is going to end American democracy, an issue he has consistently harped about, thanks to his supporters failed attempt And now this case, one tw was certain trump would lose.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Mon Jul 15 20:11:03 I’m certain he’s guilty of it not that he’d lose given the jury pool & judge (after all, nobody has yet put forth a valid defense, not that your side notices or cares... which is really weird... like so much about your cult side) the decision is being appealed, and if it fails, the case will just be refiled by the DOJ
obaminated Member	Mon Jul 15 20:19:56 "I'm certain he is guilty" Legal expert tw speaking here, not the obsessed weirdo tw who has posted about trump every day for 4 years straight.
Rugian Member	Mon Jul 15 20:32:05 "obaminated Member Mon Jul 15 19:56:31 Biden can no longer claim trump is going to end American democracy" Biden himself already admitted that the "OMG TRUMP IS GOING TO END DEMOCRACY" hysteria is bullshit. He's in this election for one reason, his ego and his ego alone. "GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS: And if you stay in and Trump is elected and everything you're warning about comes to pass, how will you feel in January? PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN: I'll feel as long as I gave it my all and I did the good as job as I know I can do, that's what this is about. " Oh, if Trump the democracy-destroying Hitler of our time takes power over this country, you'd be okay with it as long as you felt you led a good campaign? Is that how a Manichean conflict of absolute good vs. absolute evil usually works? "I did a good job, so even though the Empire won and blew up Yavin 4 I'm okay with how it all turned out," is that how it's supposed to go? Fucking evil lying senile piece of shit Biden.
Rugian Member	Mon Jul 15 20:35:38 I...*truly*...hate Biden so much. Maybe not as much as tumbleweed hates Trump, at least in the sense that I'm not willing to make 146 threads devoted exclusively to him, but he is a legitimately god-awful human being and serial liar who has spent decades putting his own career over the good of both his country and his own family. I believe he's a true "Catholic" about as much as I believe in the tooth fairy, but I do hope that a soul as black as his has a fairly rough time in the eternal afterlife.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Mon Jul 15 21:12:37 “Legal expert tw speaking here” please provide a valid defense from anyone. Trump’s own defense is a provable lie that nobody else repeats (prove me wrong). Last time i asked for defenses, you hoped for prosecutorial misconduct (not what this is, nor would it make him not guilty), and Rugian only posted how Turley doesn’t like the law. so with clear undisputed evidence of guilt and nothing but a provable lie from Trump as defense, yeah he’s guilty
tumbleweed the wanderer	Mon Jul 15 21:19:06 on Bidens bad answer, every question in that interview was basically ‘don’t you think you’re too old and wouldn’t it be better if you stepped down’, so he was trying to justify a run even if failure it’s not evidence he doesn’t see Trump as a threat to democracy... as I posted repeatedly, Trump factually tried to be appointed winner of the election with no plan to have any proof he won, that alone is proof (though also so much more)... your side just pretends theres nothing to see on sooooo much
tumbleweed the wanderer	Mon Jul 15 21:52:15 ...& of course there's the attack on the Capitol by his cultists fueled w/ his lies, entirely provoked by him, & for which he did virtually nothing to stop despite urging from his staff, family, Faux hosts, & Kevin McCarthy calling from the siege... (but your side has decided there was no attack and/or there's no correlation between Trump's daily spewing of lies & vitriol including that morning where he also told them they could still win... & of course your side unable to even hear or acknowledge all the evidence of his actions (or lack there of) during the attack)
tumbleweed the wanderer	Mon Jul 15 21:53:25 so yeah... a total mystery why people claim he's a threat to democracy...
Rugian Member	Mon Jul 15 21:58:38 tumbleweed It's January 21, 2025. Explain to me, in terms that operate within the bounds of actual reality, how Trump disbands our system of government and becomes a dictator for life. I'll wait.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Mon Jul 15 22:09:33 (wikipedia): " Between 2010 and 2020, Hungary dropped 69 places in the Press Freedom Index,[242][243] lost 11 places in the Democracy Index,[244][245] and deteriorated 16 places in the Corruption Perceptions Index.[246][247] In 2019 Freedom House downgraded the country from "free" to "partly free".[248] The V-Dem Democracy indices rank Hungary in 2021 as 96th in its "electoral democracy index" that measures "whether elections were free and fair, as well as the prevalence of a free and independent media", sitting between Benin and Malaysia.[249] Additionally, Freedom House's Nations in Transit 2020 report reclassified Hungary from a democracy to a transitional or hybrid regime.[250] Furthermore, in 2022, the European Parliament stated that "Hungary can no longer be considered a full democracy" and that the country has become an "electoral autocracy" " maybe like that given his new crush is Orban (Trump doesn't have to become dictator for life to be a threat to democracy... although he has admired leaders who HAVE become dictators for life, & crazily wanted 2 extra years because of the Mueller investigation, & will crazily want an extra 4 years because of the 'stolen' election...) now explain to me how it doesn't matter AT ALL (as in ZERO) that he tried to overthrow democracy (& will do again if he loses... he's -already- claimed there will be mass fraud this election... so his 'i'll accept the election if free & fair' means NOTHING as already saying not so)
murder Member	Tue Jul 16 08:52:36 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gH476CxJxfg
obaminated Member	Tue Jul 16 14:27:40 If trump is leading at the end of election night and by morning we discover a shit ton of mail in ballots were discovered and they were all for biden. Yes. It's safe to assume massive fraud occurred. In fact. It'd be stupid not too think that.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Tue Jul 16 15:03:04 they weren't just "discovered" in 2020 also, it was ENTIRELY known that Dem votes would come in late due to the counting methods (plus always happens given high pop areas tend to be blue & take longer)... even Faux informed their audience of this, no way team fraud didn't know or expect it, yet made plan to just declare victory early (& did so... as he's a piece of shit)
kargen Member	Tue Jul 16 18:00:57 "...& of course there's the attack on the Capitol by his cultists fueled w/ his lies," Anti-Trumpers took more guns to the rally on Saturday than the protestors took to the capital on January 6th.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Tue Jul 16 18:28:10 wrong...as usual... there -were- guns at J6 (though not sure why you're smearing guns, you specifically are the one who said guns don't matter) plus -Biden didn't invite the guy -what Biden lies was he packed with? (in fact i'm unaware of any evidence he's even a Biden supporter) -& was Biden repeatedly resisting efforts from his own allies to act? i can't think of a single thing in common... please explain (plus definitely provoking the riot is NOT the only issue showing Trump's complete disinterest in democracy or law in general)
obaminated Member	Tue Jul 16 23:04:12 Anyone else notice the internet has scrubbed a lot of information? On Sunday it was stated he was a registered republican but had donated to biden. And now you can't find the donated to biden anywhere. Also, isn't it odd that hours after the shooting the fbi declared he was a lone shooter but only today did they manage to unlock his cell phone? Does any of that make sense? The more information that comes out, (how he got so close, how the secret service snipers shared at him for 40 seconds and waited til he got 4 shots off before they responded, how the trump security forces repeatedly asked for more competent personal only to be denied, how the ladder leading to the roof where the shooter shot from was there before the rally and somehow wasn't noticed or reported by anyone and how civilians saw the shooter on the roof and spent 2 minutes trying to tell police there was a dude with a rifle on that roof and the police did nothing... Like. There is so much smoke. Deep state attempted hit on trump?
tumbleweed the wanderer	Tue Jul 16 23:45:37 no real site claimed he "donated to biden" he donated $15 to a PAC (Progressive Turnout Project) & done early 2021... no possible reason to donate money specifically for Biden at that point in time (& never any indication it was for Biden) "isn't it odd that hours after the shooting the fbi declared he was a lone shooter but only today did they manage to unlock his cell phone?" not remotely... your question is odd though...
obaminated Member	Tue Jul 16 23:59:24 You don't find it odd that the fbi concluded he was operating alone prior to fully investigating him? You find that question odd?
obaminated Member	Wed Jul 17 00:10:30 Why am I expecting a rational response from tw? The guy is legit unhinged and there is nothing to be gained from engaging with him in conversation. I will stop and ignore him.
tumbleweed the wanderer	Wed Jul 17 00:16:54 you claimed they said he was a "lone shooter", that would not require unlocking his cell phone i doubt they have concluded no possible involvement by anyone else, but feel free to prove me wrong
tumbleweed the wanderer	Wed Jul 17 00:18:33 ...should be -the- lone shooter... if no unexplained shots/bullets, he's the lone shooter
murder Member	Wed Jul 17 05:46:53 "Anti-Trumpers took more guns to the rally on Saturday than the protestors took to the capital on January 6th." http://www...pons-capitol-jan-6/7621149001/ * Lonnie Coffman of Alabama was found with multiple weapons in his vehicle and on his person. Coffman’s truck, which he had parked in the vicinity of the Capitol on the morning of Jan. 6, was packed with weaponry, including a handgun, a rifle and a shotgun, each loaded, according to court documents. In addition, the truck held hundreds of rounds of ammunition, several large-capacity ammunition feeding devices, a crossbow with bolts, machetes, camouflage smoke devices, a stun gun and 11 Molotov cocktails. When Coffman was detained, questioned and searched, police found two more handguns on his person. None of the weapons were registered, documents state. Coffman pleaded guilty and was sentenced in April to 46 months in prison followed by three years of supervised release. * Guy Reffitt of Texas was charged with bringing a handgun onto Capitol grounds. Court documents showed that Reffitt, reported to be a member of the Three Percenters militia group, told his family he brought his gun with him and that he and others "stormed the Capitol." A jury found Reffitt guilty of five felony charges in March, and he remains detained pending sentencing. * Christopher Michael Alberts of Maryland also brought his handgun onto Capitol grounds. An officer saw that Alberts had a gun on his hip and alerted fellow officers. When Alberts tried to flee, officers detained him and recovered the loaded handgun, along with a separate magazine. He has been indicted on ten felony counts. Correction: "Anti-Trumpers fired more guns at the rally on Saturday than the insurrectionists did at the capital on January 6th."
murder Member	Wed Jul 17 06:00:53 * Mark Mazza of Indiana brought two loaded handguns onto Capitol grounds on January 6; he was sentenced to 5 years in prison after pleading guilty to carrying a pistol without a license and to assaulting an officer with a dangerous weapon (a baton). * Jerod Thomas Bargar of Missouri pleaded guilty to entering and remaining on restricted Capitol grounds on January 6 with a pistol and received probation. * Mark Ibrahim, who was an off-duty special agent for the Drug Enforcement Administration at the time of the riot, has been charged with crimes including carrying a firearm on Capitol grounds on January 6; he has pleaded not guilty
kargen Member	Wed Jul 17 21:35:19 guess I fucked that one up. but tumbleweed when did I say guns don't matter?
tumbleweed the wanderer	Wed Jul 17 22:06:22 you have claimed guns have no impact for shooters... they'd just use something else and cause just as much damage (a silly view, but that's normal for you)
kargen Member	Fri Jul 19 01:38:39 how could a gun not have an impact for a shooter. Without a gun they aren't a shooter. I did say taking away guns will not stop bad people from doing bad things. I said people intent on doing harm will find a way to do harm and taking away guns will not stop them. After guns were taken away in Australia homicide by arson went up over 700%. Without guns they might cause more damage. Get in a van and drive through the crowd. It takes more effort to make a bomb but if the evil person couldn't get a gun then maybe the bomb becomes the next best thing. Stabbings with multiple victims is on the increase. Guns are not the problem and never have been.
Habebe Member	Fri Jul 19 06:06:39 Having access to guns definitley makes it easier to cause physical damage/death. Goes both ways though. Its also easier to defend ones self. Most violent attackers are young people. Some would say, young males, at least they are reported more often. So, that gives them a tactical advantage since males between the ages of 18-35 are generally able to over power most non young males. You would think the left would be in support of equity outcomes.
patom Member	Fri Jul 19 07:43:26 Having a gun for self defense worked out real good for those at that concert in Las Vegas. I do remember hearing reports of many in the production crew that had legal permitted guns on them. Of course they didn't have a clue where the shooter was. They also knew, or should know, that if they are seen walking around with their weapon in hand that the first cop that shows up is going to shoot first and ask questions later.
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