Utopia Talk / Politics / Europe needs to be destroyed

Rugian Member	Mon Aug 12 21:04:44 Fuck these election interfering assholes. I want to see the entire continent of Europe annihilated in an American-sponsored nuclear Holocaust for this shit. Europeans can die IRL. "EU sends warning letter to Musk ahead of Trump interview The European Union sent a warning letter to X owner Elon Musk on Monday reminding him of the bloc’s rules against promoting “harmful content” ahead of the billionaire tech mogul’s interview with former President Trump on the social platform. “With great audience comes greater responsibility,” wrote Thierry Breton, the EU’s commissioner for Internal Market, in a post on X. “As there is a risk of amplification of potentially harmful content in in connection with events with major audience around the world, I sent this letter to @elonmusk.” " http://the...musk-ahead-of-trump-interview/
Paramount Member	Tue Aug 13 00:25:51 ” “Let us be very clear: the European Union is an enemy of free speech and has no authority of any kind to dictate how we campaign.”’ Well, if you operate in the EU you’ve got to follow European laws. Besides, European citizens are incapable of listening to a conversation and drawing their own conclusions. Europeans may also be drawing the wrong conclusion, so our political leaders needs to protect us from ideas that are dangerous to our free and democratic societies.
Paramount Member	Tue Aug 13 00:35:05 Elon Musk @elonmusk ”There appears to be a massive DDOS attack on X. Working on shutting it down. Worst case, we will proceed with a smaller number of live listeners and post the conversation later.” It is good that Brussels take action to protect us from the discussion between Musk and Trump.
Nimatzo iChihuaha	Tue Aug 13 02:29:37 And just the other day I was explaining to sebtard that I am more skeptical towards the EU now than during Brexit. Fuck these people.
Cherub Cow Member	Tue Aug 13 05:34:53 ------------ http://x.com/CollinRugg/status/1823192200639135860 "The Donald Trump and Elon Musk X Space has concluded, with the two speaking to each other for over 2 hours. Here is what happened today on X: - Trump & Elon had over 1,000,000 listeners live during the entire Space. - Trump posted on X for the first time since, August 24, 2023. - Trump’s account received over 200 million impressions today. - Elon told European Commissioner Thierry Breton, who wanted to censor the Trump Space, to “f*ck your own face.”" ------------ I definitely like the part where Musk told Breton to literally fuck his own face. http://x.com/elonmusk/status/1823076043017630114
Seb Member	Tue Aug 13 06:48:49 Rugian: You guys extradited bankers for a lawful transaction between two EU based organisations based solely on the data traversing a US based server. Twitter does business in the EU. A third of its revenue comes from selling adds in the EU. A very simple way to get around this is for them to stop doing this.
Seb Member	Tue Aug 13 06:51:13 Nim: Would your view of the EUs position on twitter change if you knew that since Musk took over, twitter is the world leading platform for Islamic extremist material and Hamas propoganda videos? That's because they gutted moderation. It's also much worse than the other platforms for CSAM. The two things you often go on about most.
murder Member	Tue Aug 13 07:27:50 "Twitter does business in the EU. A third of its revenue comes from selling adds in the EU." The EU should shut it down. It's just an open sewage pit at this point.
Rugian Member	Tue Aug 13 07:41:20 Imagine being such a shill for the EU that you defend its blatantly anti-democratic and authoritarian actions EVEN AFTER YOUR OWN COUNTRY LEFT IT. Glad to know that this is what "democracy" means to you. A bunch of continental bureaucrats dictate what they consider "acceptable" speech for the entire world. Jesus Christ Seb.
Nimatzo iChihuaha	Tue Aug 13 08:00:27 Nice attempt by sebtard to re-frame the conversation as explicit *criminal activity*: EU goon wags a threatening finger at Musk, trying to poison the well, and Sebtard is talking about child porn and terrorist videos. Such a clever little cockroach, lock step with his masters.
murder Member	Tue Aug 13 08:54:49 "A bunch of continental bureaucrats dictate what they consider "acceptable" speech for the entire world." There's nothing forcing twitter to operate in the entire world.
Rugian Member	Tue Aug 13 09:01:34 Murder Yes, the way things are going, the internet is eventually going to need to be de-globalized, with American companies operating exclusively in the United States in order to avoid the bullshit regulations of every Third World shithole that thinks itself important enough to impose their own standards upon us (aka Europe).
Seb Member	Tue Aug 13 09:21:49 Murder: I don't think the EU should shut it down, but insisting they get rid of the kiddie porn, terrorist propoganda and that musk stop boosting conspiracy theories would be a start.
Seb Member	Tue Aug 13 09:26:37 Rugian: I wasn't aware that insisting they take down kiddie porn, terror videos, blatant incitement etc was authoritarian. As for picking fights, Musk picks these fights himself when he tries to interfere in European politics. Nim: It is about explicit criminal activity. That's what the current open investigation is about. The letter also warns regarding incitement, not surprising given that Musk appears to be trying to stoke civil unrest in Europe with his tweets by amplifying outright lies suggesting Muslims are now being prosecuted for the crimes they commit etc. I suppose the better alternative might be to treat Musk personally like a Russian troll farm and use active cyber measures against him. But a politely measured letter is a good first approach.
Seb Member	Tue Aug 13 09:28:45 Rugian: The EU commission would like nothing better than US firms to voluntarily crease trading in Europe. It took China a few years to build their own rivals to Amazon, Instagram, Twitter etc. We need to remove American monopolist tech firms from our market places to develop our own alternatives and block acquisitions. It will be much better if the US firms go voluntarily though.
Cherub Cow Member	Tue Aug 13 09:41:01 [sebfag (traitor to the West)]: "and that musk stop boosting conspiracy theories would be a start." It's just like Nim said. See how sebfag had to give himself an entryway into total censorship there? He couldn't just stop at the obvious red herring issues; he had to add in that total blanket for mass-censorship of wrongthink. "Conspiracy theories" to a leftist just means "narratives not approved by the global totalitarian Regime".
Seb Member	Tue Aug 13 10:06:41 For example CC, he recently posted about a Muslim who "raped" a child and only got a few months sentence as an example of "two tier policing" Only he's neglected to point out that the guy in question was an accessory rather than one of the two men who raped the girl, and was in fact a minor himself at the time (15 iirc). This is a lie, and he posted this in response to the current riots. It's inflammatory and deliberately so. It's very clear that the American right are trying to stir up trouble in Europe to use as a scare story to mobilise their base in the forthcoming elections. Why the fuck should we let you do that? It's a foreign psyops campaign by non-state actors. In the US you regulate such interference far more tightly through things like FISA.
Rugian Member	Tue Aug 13 10:12:32 Seb Like European markets are competitive enough to ever allow for the technological breakthroughs that American capitalism has produced. I'm talking about the EU threatening to censor an interview with a man who may very well be the next president of the United States, and you are responding with commemnt about porn and terrorist videos. Red herring much? Musk as a private citizen is fully allowed to opine on affairs in other countries. That's how freedom of speech works bro. It's the exact same doctrine that lets me say that Europe is a terminally declining shithole that destroyed itself with socialism and leftwing social policies and is now importing Muslims to replace the native population because the latter stopped breeding decades ago. What a fucking failure future generations will think of Sebbian-style governance.
Cherub Cow Member	Tue Aug 13 10:38:43 [sebfag (traitor to the West)]: "Why the fuck should we let you do that? It's a foreign psyops campaign by non-state actors." Good point when flipped. I.e., why *should* we allow foreign actors such as sebfag to have a voice in the West? Probably they should be deprived of the franchise, tried for treason, and punished appropriately. We know this because sebbish traitors have no problem punishing their own citizens for "inflammatory" speech (i.e., speech that they do not like), so we know that sebguls are not Westerners at all.
Habebe Member	Tue Aug 13 10:49:16 "Well, if you operate in the EU you’ve got to follow European laws." But let's be honest, thats negotiable. If Trump wins and the EU bans X, he is likely to triple the price of fuel. As, is fair really in this case. Seb, "Twitter does business in the EU. A third of its revenue comes from selling adds in the EU. A very simple way to get around this is for them to stop doing this." This was a dumb move from a US perspective.It may play well in domestically in the EU. But, realistically, do you see Trump/Elon backing down because of the eu? It's not likely. If Trump wins, he absolutely will respond to this.
Seb Member	Tue Aug 13 10:59:45 CC: "we allow foreign actors such as sebfag to have a voice in the West" Americans, the 'We' in your sentence aren't the west, and like I said, you tightly regulate foreign political activity.
Seb Member	Tue Aug 13 11:01:12 Habebe: "If Trump wins and the EU bans X, he is likely to triple the price of fuel." And then the EU bans Amazon, which is the real win for Europe.
Seb Member	Tue Aug 13 11:12:30 "This was a dumb move from a US perspectiv" Yes but, the thing Americans don't get, is that Trump made the US position on things increasingly irrelevant. As I've said before. Nobody in EU capitals is wondering what the US thinks about things so much. They are assuming the worst possible outcome and taking steps to mitigate it. "do you see Trump/Elon backing down because of the eu?" Do you think they want Trump or Musk to back down, or do you think they want to create the market space for local tech firms? Trump set out a vision of Europe as an economic competitor to Europe with no common global strategic relationship, rather than the economic partnership and military alliance previously. This not only shredded American soft power in Europe, but the EU commission, most member states and other European powers decided it meant that they could never trust the US again commercially, industrially, diplomatically or in the security domain and strategic autonomy was an overwhelming priority. They will pursue it's own policies towards rest of the world too. Biden didn't change that because you can always elect another Trump. Nothing will change this trajectory now. And if America doesn't like things, it doesn't really matter enough to change things. Even if there is short term costs, that's now considered baked in to avoid bigger long term costs. It's frankly amazing to see a country just give up such overwhelming advantages.
Cherub Cow Member	Tue Aug 13 11:19:23 [sebfag (traitor to the West)]: "Americans, the 'We' in your sentence aren't the west, and like I said, you tightly regulate foreign political activity." Subversive lies. You love nothing of the West and instead in slavish inversion want its degradation and destruction. Your worst conception of some "low-class" "ugly American" is infinitely greater than anything you have ever offered the West, so your critiques of your betters act only as insults of yourself in the very comparison.
Sam Adams Member	Tue Aug 13 11:32:18 http://x.com/Mick_O_Keeffe/status/1823329085541564586 A small peaceful town of 200 irish is being forced at gunpoint by the state to accept 280 negro invaders. Europe is destroying itself.
Dukhat Member	Tue Aug 13 11:32:25 Elon is such a piece of shit narcissist. What a joke the conservative party has become. They're brownshirts for wannabe dictators and billionaires.
Sam Adams Member	Tue Aug 13 11:45:15 http://x.com/EuropeInvasionn/status/1823301229570560228 Import the third world, become the third world.
murder Member	Tue Aug 13 12:02:54 "A small peaceful town of 200 irish is being forced at gunpoint by the state to accept 280 negro invaders." If you knew your US history, you'd know that the Irish are a step below negroes.
Rugian Member	Tue Aug 13 12:54:58 "If you knew your US history, you'd know that the Irish are a step below negroes." Because they were low-skilled migrants willing to work for pennies on the dollar. And because they tended to bring disease and poverty to cities and towns that didn't previously suffer from those things. And because they were Catholics. And Irish. But also, it was because they weren't slaves, and therefore it wasn't "trendy" among middle class social circles to advocate for their cause like it was for the negroes. I'm not quite so sure that the comparison is entirely apt for modern 21st century Ireland and migrant Third Worlders.
Habebe Member	Tue Aug 13 20:47:09 "And then the EU bans Amazon, which is the real win for Europe." If by Europe, you mean, greater Russia. The EU effectivley has no military. I don't say that as a sneer, they just have relativley a minimalist military. Sam, "Import the third world, become the third world." Yes, and no. Import the dregs of society anywhere, enmasse, and you'll have problems. I would rather live next to your run of the mill Ugandan, compared to, your run of the mill person from any west coast major city. Actually, thats what we should do, we should allow more immigrants in, but we will ship our commies to the nation sending the immigrants. There is no way we lose in that exchange.
Sam Adams Member	Tue Aug 13 22:12:52 "the Irish are a step below negroes." Nah, irish have like 1 or 2 stupid/low iq genes. Negroes have about 47.
Sam Adams Member	Tue Aug 13 22:39:08 http://x.com/9mm_smg/status/1823504954931196310 Adult negress throws white child to ground with 0 remorse. "This looks completely fine" says seb
Cherub Cow Member	Tue Aug 13 23:38:03 [Habebe]: "Actually, thats what we should do, we should allow more immigrants in, but we will ship our commies to the nation sending the immigrants." Absolutely not. Deport all leftists *and* deport the migrants. The left is using a racialist strategy (Bio-Leninism) to destroy Western civilization. You cannot ignore it, and you cannot appeal to the left's "better nature" since they have none. They are actively trying to conquer you. Irish police showing up to keep locals from opposing their replacement. Irishman Shane James talks to them: http://x.com/TezTruth81/status/1823290812983042152
Seb Member	Wed Aug 14 03:33:15 CC: I'm not going to be lectured on what the west is from someone with the cultural and intellectual depth of paint. You would be much happier in Russia I think.
Seb Member	Wed Aug 14 03:38:54 Habebe: "If by Europe, you mean, greater Russia." Nope. "The EU effectivley has no military." Indeed that's correct. European Member states on the other hand, not so. "I don't say that as a sneer, they just have relativley a minimalist military." Not for global force protection, perhaps, plenty for regional. American military power isn't relevant to Europe if you aren't willing to use it to deter Russia. And we know you are deterred by nuclear threats, and Europe has two nuclear powers. So, yes, why not stop the huge leakage of commerce and tax to the US via Amazon? Make it impossible for them to operate, and let national alternatives by their data centres, warehouse and distribution fleets when they sell-up and exit. It's not rocket science.
Cherub Cow Member	Wed Aug 14 05:18:35 [sebtard (traitor to the West)]: "I'm not going to be lectured on what the west is from someone with the cultural and intellectual depth of paint." That's pathetic projection, sebtard. No one is fooled by this. Everyone knows that you are incompetent, retarded, and probably one of those autists who cannot read facial expressions. No reasonable person would read your drivel and find it captivating or thoughtful, so your comparison only insults yourself once again. And I'll remind everyone here that I have repeatedly asked sebfag to say something about the West that he loves and would absolutely defend — some inviolable thing which is a clear line in the sand which would stop his many treasons in their tracks and rouse him to defend the West. He cannot do it. He cannot do it because he is a traitor. What firm principle could a traitor hold? None. His only response to questions about "the West" would be to deconstruct what "the West" even *is* so that he does not have to do anything. Cowards function in this way, and sebfag is a coward indeed. This is why a stream of foreigners is to him no different than English natives. This is why he believes that a foreigner who stabbed English people was actually just a "Christian" and perhaps even "Welsh". This is why he lies by pretending that there is no difference between masses of Chinese and African migrants. This is why he cannot admit that there are genetic differences between the English and the African. This is why there is no lower limit on how much of an absolute minority Englishmen become on their own soil. After all, to the sebfag, people are "interchangeable widgets". These things are merely cudgels of deception which sebfag uses to sell the West its annihilation. If sebfag pretends that these issues do not exist, then he can continue to lie about the Regime's openly stated plan to ethnically genocide the West using Bio-Leninism. Simply notice that sebfag has never presented a principle which he holds dearly and which would contribute to the survival of the West. Think hard. He has never done it.
Sam Adams Member	Wed Aug 14 10:57:38 "So, yes, why not stop the huge leakage of commerce and tax to the US via Amazon?" Lol what are you going to do in place of amazon? Create your own internet companies? With what talent do you intend to do this with? Your own? Lmfao.
Sam Adams Member	Wed Aug 14 11:00:21 All those computer scientists you are importing from rwanda and pakistan? Lol
Seb Member	Wed Aug 14 12:02:00 CC: "And I'll remind everyone here that I have repeatedly asked sebfag to say something about the West that he loves and would absolutely defend" Have you? I told you, I don't read much of your posts beyond the first insult. You have so little to say and are too tediously bloviated in how you say it. I've set out many of the things I value about Western Liberal thought over the years with other people. Think of me as a Whig. But I'm not going to justify myself to you as though you are some gatekeeper of Western values when you are *not* from the school of Western cultural thought at all. You are far closer to Russian conservatives than have pretentions to the trappings of Western civilization but are fundamentally rooted in an Eastern authoritarianism. There's no point describing what I value in Western values - you wouldn't understand it because the values you hold are antithetical to it.
Seb Member	Wed Aug 14 12:05:50 Sam: "Lol what are you going to do in place of amazon? Create your own internet companies?" Yup. "With what talent do you intend to do this with? Your own? Lmfao." Yup, there's a reason Google and Amazon keep buying up European firms - it's not because they are crap people full of morons. It's because they can see good IP and they fear competition and don't want to let them scale. There's nothing particularly hard about what these companies do other than competing with businesses that have already reached scale and are allowed to cross subsidise product lines. Yup.
Seb Member	Wed Aug 14 12:12:45 I mean Google literally bought deep mind, a UK based firm, for however many hundred million it was - because Deep Mind knew it couldn't scale against aggressive undercutting from established cloud providers with worse technology but vastly greater compute infrastructure and equal access to customers. So yeah, that's the route for Europe: exclude the competition for basic commodity services like online retail, social media etc, allow domestic firms to fill the market gap and build scale in infra (i.e. cloud compute) and then progressively move up the value chain, squeezing US competitors out.
Seb Member	Wed Aug 14 18:51:46 Lol, "perfect military"? What's that exactly? Put it this way, combined EU member states have more armoured fighting vehicles than the US, and that's not non EU European NATO meets including Turkey and the UK. When it comes to combat jets, artillery, naval forces, again we collectively outnumber and outmatch what Russia can provide. The US isn't needed to defend the core EU. It is needed to roll back (and thus deter) attacks on the periphery (Baltics, non NATO European countries) but if the US isn't going to do that (and may even try to prevent it) then yes, to transform this largely defence based posture to global power projection will need capability building. But that's the whole point: the capabilities needed include re-shoring the technology and logistical supply chain, making building a European tech supply chain. Think Airbus. Hence it no longer being acceptable to have American monopolies crowd out market access for European firms of scale as a trade off for things like biotech and machine tooling and other areas where European firms excel. To be honest, the EU is going to be able to build a European Google and Amazon if those companies are excluded from EU markets a long time before America will be able to make a competitor to ASML. The long term consequence will be unwinding globalisation with a resultant reduction in growth (consumers on both sides lose the benefit of competitive advantage) and loss of American global hegemony as the EU will pursue it's own commercial, trade and strategic relationship with China to its own interests. For example, if the US pursues attempts to leverage it's position in global capital markets and financial systems to limit China, and this is inconvenient for the EU, then the EU and China will likely bypass them and effectively leave the US sanctioning itself.
Seb Member	Wed Aug 14 18:57:43 "we would want some things to make it worth while." What I'm telling you is what you have *now* is not natural. It's what makes the US security guarantees worthwhile. EU broad foreign and economic policy alignment and market access for US firms is only worthwhile in the context of a broad alliance with the US. If it is transaccional, then none of that is worthwhile for the EU, and the result will be a substantial long term impact on the US both from the damage to the trade relationship with Europe itself but also the relationship with the rest of the world as with the loss of the ability to coordinate things like economic sanctions with the EU without transactional deal making, the ability to influence third countries is also greatly diminished. It's an absurdly silly and hubristic move.
Seb Member	Wed Aug 14 19:15:24 "The EU needs the US" This is the mistaken thinking. The EU needed the US to provide regional and global security. The US demonstrated it wouldn't do this. Given that what the EU needs is regional and global security, and there's no way of securing that, then what it needs is it's own capacity for regional security and strategic autonomy to negotiate global insecurity. That requires de-integrating the US from key industrial supply chains and markets. This is more expensive all around than the previous arrangements, but that's no longer an option, and pursuing de-integration and onshoring industrial and commercial capabilities currently imported from the US is less expensive and less risky than living with the Trumpian transaccional model that wishes to extract an additional premium at each crisis. The inevitable incentive for the US will be to bank long term premiums and then ratchet those up at each crisis, which is an incentive to allow crises to occur rather than avoid them. A version of North Korean diplomacy. This is the fundamental problem - you think this is one hand in an ongoing game you can win. The EU has decided the game isn't worth playing, and has left the table and is now doing it's own thing (almost certainly to America's detriment). This is what I mean by "irrelevant". What the EU needs (regional and global stability) the US isn't now able to provide (even if it has the intention and capacity, it lacks the credibility) so there's no deal to be had and the quid pro quo of the old deal no longer makes sense, and to the extent there are costs of changing that, there are bigger benefits that can now only be achieved by pursuing strategic autonomy. So that's what's going to happen.
Sam Adams Member	Wed Aug 14 20:45:32 "Yup, there's a reason Google and Amazon keep buying up European firms - it's not because they are crap people full of morons. It's because they can see good IP" Lol. Most competent coders left the UK long ago. Many left the EU too but at least the alpine countries still have a decent liveability. The uk is just fucked.
Seb Member	Wed Aug 14 20:54:27 Sam: Such cope. Ok, so it's no skin off of your nose then. Europe will come crying back etc. Coding is easy, in fact it's automatable (using tech invented in the UK). The US excels at industrialisation (though China is getting better than you at that thanks to HBS brain), not innovation. Once the incentive is there, it's not complicated to bring that back on shore. Just disruptive. But needs-must of national security is on the line. Just need to follow the Chinese playbook.
Seb Member	Wed Aug 14 21:42:45 Habebe: Another thing you are missing, even if you believe the EU can't produce domestic equivalents to Google etc. China already has. Trump/US conservatives loudly say that they are opposed to the EU and broader European values (they express it vice versa but from our perspective that's what it means). So... why Amazon and not Temu or Ali-baba? The latter two are much cheaper. Ok, they spy on us - but then the entire issue with us tech companies is those companies spy on us to exploit individuals and businesses, and the us govt can access that data by law. Given China is in no position to be a military threat to Europe (Europe's main trade in Asia is with China itself), there's no issue there. Why *not* cultivate China as an alternative partner to the US and play both of against eachother, if there's no broader ideological or shared world order? The US wants a competitive and transactional relationship, and a competitive and transactional relationship with China is the best we can hope for there. So ... cultivate China as a trade partner and BATNA for any discussions with the US or US based industries, and make them compete.
Seb Member	Wed Aug 14 21:44:29 This is all so dumb. It's like the household fallacy for national budgets. Treating counties as businesses within a regulated market with enforced laws rather than sovereign states.
jergul large member	Thu Aug 15 02:51:17 I deleted the thread stretching post with grumpy predjudice.
Seb Member	Thu Aug 15 05:26:35 The one where Habebe posted a link to countries rated by "perfect military" score?
Sam Adams Member	Thu Aug 15 12:50:41 http://x.com/EuropeInvasionn/status/1824047925694960010 Invaders demand more invaders.
Habebe Member	Sun Aug 18 09:31:37 "Another thing you are missing, even if you believe the EU can't produce domestic equivalents to Google etc. China already has." Yes and no. China has made knock offs popular in China. It still doesn't compare. You love the word transactional. Which, just means you wish the EU to mooch off of the US. --------- Again, I actually am not picking on the EU. But France is the military might of the EU....I mean come on. ---------- As for cultivating a relationship with China, yeah, probably not a terrible idea. How did that even become an issue? We were taking about how the EU will fare when Trump isnre elected.
jergul large member	Sun Aug 18 10:04:04 Hababe France is not disarming itself to help Ukraine. Most other countries in Europe are.
TheChildren Member	Sun Aug 18 10:07:41 rememba habebe actually claimed that china had no ev cars just 2 years ago... i laughed hard and posted several big brand names. and as usual, most yankoids just shrug and live in alternative reality, aliceincloudland. fast4ward now, da whole world knows chinas ev cars r da best now. rememba this is his view of china: china makes knock offs that dunt compare da man is livin in aliceincloudland
Seb Member	Sun Aug 18 10:39:45 Habebe: "China has made knock offs popular in China." Increasingly popular in the west too: Temu and Aliexpress are used. It's fine for European apps to be popular in Europe. "still doesn't compare." In what way doesn't it compare? In the sense that we make it much easier for Amazon to do business than Temu and Alibaba? Well sure, but that's kinda my point. Let's make it equally hard for American firms to do business in Europe and bring these jobs and profits back home.
Seb Member	Sun Aug 18 10:47:27 "Which, just means you wish the EU to mooch off of the US" Weren't you the one that just asked "What's in it for us"? That's what I mean by transactional. Kick out the US firms, bring the jobs and profits back home, take the hit on its trade sanctions coming back (whatevs), with with China, Asia and Africa to bypass the US financial system to facilitate have and build our own industrial and technology supply chain, and kick out US forces from Europe. A 25 year project in total. We can negotiate bilateral trade deals with the US as and when it aligns with strategic priorities, but obviously key industries like tech and defence need to be sovereign and we need to protect our citizens from US state interference and spying. We know US companies are subject to US security firms. Just like you ate trying to squeeze out TicToc. If you get into another war with terrorists like Afghanistan or whatever, we can discuss how much you want to pay for overflight rights and rear bases on a case by case basis. As you say, no more mooching - we do point in time deals in future, where we know what we all get out of each deal.
Sam Adams Member	Sun Aug 18 11:49:25 Ahahahahahahahaha the uk is an obvious parody of left wing insanity but its real. http://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c15gn0lq7p5o Misogyny to be treated as extremism by UK government
Cherub Cow Member	Mon Aug 19 01:23:14 [sebfag (outright liar, traitor to the West, likely pederast)]: "But I'm not going to justify myself to you as though you are some gatekeeper of Western values when you are *not* from the school of Western cultural thought at all. You are far closer to Russian conservatives than have pretentions to the trappings of Western civilization but are fundamentally rooted in an Eastern authoritarianism. There's no point describing what I value in Western values - you wouldn't understand it because the values you hold are antithetical to it." Do we see how brazenly sebfag lies? As many times as I have taken the political compass test, I have never passed into authoritarian. I am consistently libertarian right because I love liberty and know my duty to defend it. There is nothing "Eastern" about me. Nothing. I am entirely of the West. I know exactly where I can find the bones of my ancestors, and I build their temples in the Western style. My reverence and loyalty to these lands and my people is eternal and relentless. I learned and learn from as many materials from the Western tradition as I could and can — even as sebbish destroyers try to pull these Great Works from the universities to appease their foreign puppets and gain Xerxes' gold. I will proclaim Western virtues a thousand times and bravely and without a moment's hesitation or regret. Were my choices infinite, I would live them again gladly, and my choices bring life even to forgotten Western ruins. Sebfag, on the other hand, is a treasonous swine with no conscience and no remorse for his many treasons. Even when directly called to ask for *one* *solitary* piece of evidence his best answer — even still! — is "[hur hur, I don't have to justify myself! Besides! I'm illiterate!]" He can say this because his gods are not our own, so there is no book he could swear upon that we would recognize as noble. He is "antithetical", but not to the East as he liarly claims by innuendo — but to the West. He serves devils and Eastern liars — the god of the Jew, Satan, and any power that would destroy the West. This is why his every word is written through the inversions of the slave revolt, whereas the West as a core principle resists sebbish slaveries. It is so obvious that *sebfag* is antithetical to the West that his very attempt to invert his own inversions is pathetically transparent. Sebfag is an anti-White, anti-Western traitor, who openly supports White genocide and pederasty and mutilation against Western children (e.g., LGBTQ2S+NAMBLA, sustainability governance, pro-migration leftist treason). If he is not completely retarded, then he is so abysmally subversive that he must indeed be a Jew. Certainly he has adopted their Eastern enslavement strategies, being as he is a destroyer who can never and has never built anything noble. He claims to have demonstrated "Western Liberal thought over the years" — itself a statement which chokes virtue with his duplicitous use of "Liberal" — but even removing the statement of its sebbish duplicity, I say again, "Think hard. He has never done it."
obaminated Member	Mon Aug 19 01:36:38 It is pretty funny the mental gymantics seb goes through. "I didn't read your post" "But I won't let you specify western Europe principles " "So I won't say any principles " Jesus christ what a loser.
obaminated Member	Mon Aug 19 01:37:46 Just odd the top of my head "Equality" Of the law Of speech Of politics Somehow all that is a difficult question for seb
obaminated Member	Mon Aug 19 01:39:44 "From the river to the sea" is inciting hateful speech and yet seb doesn't see it or he ignores it because those Muslims haven't reached his neighborhood yet.
Sam Adams Member	Mon Aug 19 07:39:40 http://x.com/EuropeInvasionn/status/1825486245926944923 Yet another uk mass stabbing by a migrant. The state security is still trying to round up white men for tweeting about it.
Seb Member	Mon Aug 19 07:57:27 Obaminated: It's not mental gymnastics. My position on CC is very clear: 1. Her writing style is convoluted word salad. 2. For all her bluster about libertarianism, she's profoundly opposed to any democratic institution pursuing policies she doesn't agree with and labels then traitors. This isn't in the democratic tradition, it's in the Russian tradition of laying claim to liberal enlightenment values while in practice pursuing fundamentally authoritarian nationalist practice. 3. She's very boring, and I don't need to read or jump through purity tests set by a tedious, verbose lunatic. Especially because in the past when I've responded to such, she just says words to the effect of "no, you are lying". It's not about difficulty, it's about fruitfulness. Most of you here are a waste of time. CC is another level.
TheChildren Member	Mon Aug 19 09:05:15 yankoids r pure denialists livin in stage 1 of da 5 stages of da grief even 2 years ago, china had da best ev cars. and way more than just 1 name. no yankoids even know bout it. and they just presumed and assumed and swallowed da propagunda from there media thinkin they had da best shit. when in reality, ur livin a fantasyworld propelled by propagundfa and da only reason u see teslas everywhere and not chinese cars is coz it is artifically created by ur govurnment. coz they colludin with ur propagundamedia 2 not speak about chinese cars and then they block or make it unavailable 2 u. so u neva heard of it and think it dont exists... like phones. rofl, ur literally frogs livin in a tiny well by now lookin up da extremely limited skyviews and think thats all there is 2 it. lolololollllll everyone else knows betta though
Cherub Cow Member	Wed Aug 21 08:22:00 [sebtard (traitor to the West, liar, subversive, Regime sycophant, likely pederast)]: "[CC's] writing style is convoluted word salad." False. I speak very clearly. I do not use word salad. Everyone who is not a Regime sycophant and liar can understand me. I always explain my terms and do not load my language for rhetorical deceptions (while you do), and when I am asked for clarification I give it without obfuscation or deflection (while you do). You pretend not to understand because your lies and your pretense of illiteracy serve your subversive interests. Your illiteracy is always timed "conveniently" with an argument that you wish to avoid so as not to expose your evil ideology. Sam demonstrated this exact principle with the Chinese/African question. You did not answer that either — not because of "word salad", which is merely your liar's excuse for my posts — but because of yet another excuse. You will always have an excuse when people have a question that exposes you. But you are already completely out in the open. People know what you are. [sebtard (traitor to the West, liar, subversive, Regime sycophant, likely pederast)]: "For all her bluster about libertarianism, she's profoundly opposed to any democratic institution pursuing policies she doesn't agree with and labels then traitors." You have spoken one truth but buried it in your usual avalanche of lies and obfuscations. I am indeed right-wing libertarian *but* in the *Western* tradition of liberty, *and* I do not agree with "democratic institution[s]" — and neither did the founding fathers with whose principles I agree. It is from *them* that I primarily draw my reason — *not* from some subversive foreigner throwing open the Gates of Toledo. You are outright lying when you claim a "Russian ... authoritarian" mode, as I outright reject their Eastern subversions and have outright opposed Dugin's strategy against the West — a strategy with which *you* align but project upon me because it fits your liarly character. I have detailed this in previous threads. You agree with Dugin's strategy of destroying the West through a slave revolt. You are an Eastern subversive effecting this revolt. If you support "sustainability"/ESG, then this is who you are. "Democratic" principles are Bolshevik principles, and the founders warned exactly about Jews such as yourself who would use democracy to subvert the Western principles of liberty and nobility. It was for this reason that the founders established a *republic*, *hated* democracy, and limited the franchise to free land-holding Whites of European stock — those who could sustain the nobility of society and guide its future for *their* posterity. You Jews and your fellow Bolsheviks, on the other hand, promote "democracy" because "democracy" merely means the falsification of consent ("manufactured consent") through mass propaganda. The Bolsheviks used "democracy" to destroy Russia and execute its tsars. They even used the same propaganda phrase as the current Bolsheviks: "our democracy". They placed those words in the paper after brutalizing and executing the children of Tsar Nicholas II — raping, defiling, and scorching with acid the body of 17-year-old Anastasia "in Accordance with our new democratic principles". Democracy for Bolsheviks such as sebfag is the easiest gateway into managerial control of a society, since the popular «dēmos» (the people) can be manipulated through propaganda into fulfilling the mission of Bolshevik oligarchs who hide behind bureaucracy while the Inner Party establishes global totalitarianism. This is the Bolshevik "democracy" utility that sebfag supports. Democracy is merely a step towards messianic enslavement: Monarchy / aristocracy (potential historical start) ↓ Republic ↓ democracy / ochlocracy under propaganda ↓ Messianic-totalitarian democracy ↓ Messianic enslavement (goal) In Marxism, the "dictatorship of the proletariat" (a pro-Bolshevik-oligarch slave revolt) is merely "democracy under propaganda" — a segue into giving ultimate control to Bolshevik oligarchs. With sebfags controlling propaganda, the people do not make the "wrong" choice since their choices are guided by propagandists and Regime apparatchiks. All that the Regime need do is appeal to the largest section of the mob and get that mob to destroy the liberty of others on behalf of the collective, which then suffers collectively as slaves (e.g., removing the First and Second Amendments, removing the Supreme Court, removing the Senate, making D.C. and Puerto Rico into states). ****** ****** In other words, Bolsheviks such as sebfag love "our democracy" because all that "democracy" needs in order to establish totalitarian tyranny is propaganda to direct the people and mass-migration to replace any voting blocs that do not accept that propaganda. This is why sebfag always falls on the wrong side of immigration and propaganda (e.g., anti-Twitter, anti-"hate speech", anti-"platforming"). This is why he supports faceless bureaucracy and collectivism. This is why he pretend to be blind to the ancestry of the English and of the European in general. Under this managerial system, propaganda and immigration is controlled by Bolshevik oligarchs *against* the will of those who establish liberty and nobility for their own sovereign societies. Infecting the bureaucracy with Bolshevism (the managerial state) ensures that accountability for this treason remains hidden until mass-migration has replaced those who might effectively resist. For sebfag, it is completely appropriate to replace a population that does not comply — annihilating it for the goal of globalist enslavement. For liars and subversives such as sebfag, they begin with this call for "democracy" because the common slave believes it grants him or her power — but it does not. They champion "immigration for GDP" because they have no loyalty to Western peoples (they could not even be convinced to deny enfranchisement for these GDP-boosting immigrants!). They champion the permanent "expert" class because these "experts" are controlled and managed by the Regime's prestige network; "truth" can only happen with Party approval, and the replacement of one official with another identical official does not stop the Bolshevik "progress" (the annihilation of free peoples to create a permanent slave caste). "Big Brother" was never Hitler; he was a symbol of this Bolshevik control of all bureaucracies: a collective of "Little Stalins" (fingermen, hall monitors, reporters, collaborators) who tyrannize themselves and reach into all of society on behalf of the Party. And sebfag is such a bureaucrat, doing his part for this immoral and anti-Western collective of destroyers. sebfag is Winston, and he loves Big Brother. ****** ****** [sebtard (traitor to the West, liar, subversive, Regime sycophant, likely pederast)]: "and I don't need to read or jump through purity tests" You are lying because you are a traitor. You won't jump through "purity tests" because you are a traitor and are afraid of being totally exposed. But everyone knows already that you are a traitor. You are no longer deceiving anyone. We know what you are. Just like with tumblefag and the other leftists, your feigned illiteracy and social-media ADHD brainrot will not be accepted as an excuse when the Troubles begin. Remember this as your every political action brings us closer to the Troubles and you yourself could have stopped all of it but chose not to do so. When those horrors become inescapable for you, remember that all that it would have required is that you sincerely love the West, but you could not even think of a single way to fake such a belief much less hold Western virtue in your heart to save it.
Cherub Cow Member	Wed Aug 21 08:33:06 This is the kind of Bolshevism that sebfag supports: "Michelle Obama says Americans don't have a right to decide who enters our country: "No one has a monopoly on what it means to be an American! No one!"" http://x.com/theblaze/status/1826090396771840275 Think about that Bolshevik reckoning: • Anyone can enter the country ("no one is 'illegal'"). • Anyone can say the magic words, get the paper, and 'assimilate' • Anyone who does not 'assimilate' is still just as 'American' as anybody else anyways (why would we kick out people who want to destroy America?! That's their right!) • No one person can say what it means to be 'American' anyways: the collective bureaucracy will determine this, and anyone can be an 'American' on paper, so the bureaucracy has no limits. Bolsheviks such as sebfag would just replace you if you're not compliant. That is "democracy". They pretend not to be traitors as they destroy everything about Western tradition and import millions of people from the "Global South" who are free to retain whatever Eastern values they had from wherever they came.
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